How fast can US Air Force scramble jets?
- Thread starter johnv709
- Start date
If they're on alert with weapons and fuel on board then all they need to do is taxi and get to fighting altitude, five minutes maybe (maybe less).
Otherwise it depends entirely on the details of it's loadout and readiness, if it's completely unfuelled and unarmed in it's hangar then it could take a lot longer depending how good the organisation around it is.
Actually, "depending how good the organisation around it is" is going to be the answer to most simple questions like this that you ask. Any modern fighter can go from the hangar to combat in a very short amount of time but it is entirely dependent on a thousand logistical, command, training and doctrine factors for how effective it actually is.
Most first-world nations can detect a potential attack long before it arrives and have their aircraft ready when they are needed, obviating the need for a 'scramble' as you would see in war movies rendering your question largely irrelevant to a modern force like the USAF.
Otherwise it depends entirely on the details of it's loadout and readiness, if it's completely unfuelled and unarmed in it's hangar then it could take a lot longer depending how good the organisation around it is.
Actually, "depending how good the organisation around it is" is going to be the answer to most simple questions like this that you ask. Any modern fighter can go from the hangar to combat in a very short amount of time but it is entirely dependent on a thousand logistical, command, training and doctrine factors for how effective it actually is.
Most first-world nations can detect a potential attack long before it arrives and have their aircraft ready when they are needed, obviating the need for a 'scramble' as you would see in war movies rendering your question largely irrelevant to a modern force like the USAF.
weasel1962
New Member
Re:
Next time one goes to the airport, one can observe for himself. Its ~ the same time to take off a fighter compared to a jumbo (except for traffic that may delay the taxi-ing bit and a jumbo probably needs a longer runway due to weight). Possibly at 1XX+ knots which makes it under a minute to take off for all fighters in general from start of runway. The difference in take off times between a fighter and a jumbo is measured in seconds.
Well-designed military airfields reduce the amount of taxi required from hanger to runway.
From an obvious mathematical pov, the ability to intercept also depends on the proximity of the airield to target. If the airfield is further away, the time needed to vector the aircraft to intercept is similarly increased.
Next time one goes to the airport, one can observe for himself. Its ~ the same time to take off a fighter compared to a jumbo (except for traffic that may delay the taxi-ing bit and a jumbo probably needs a longer runway due to weight). Possibly at 1XX+ knots which makes it under a minute to take off for all fighters in general from start of runway. The difference in take off times between a fighter and a jumbo is measured in seconds.
Well-designed military airfields reduce the amount of taxi required from hanger to runway.
From an obvious mathematical pov, the ability to intercept also depends on the proximity of the airield to target. If the airfield is further away, the time needed to vector the aircraft to intercept is similarly increased.
To answer the original question: Default NATO QRA alert time is 15 minutes (in DEFCON 5), although the local CRC can lower that to ten (DEFCON 4), five (DEFCON 3) or even two minutes (DEFCON 2) depending on current state of affairs.
At 5 minutes (DEFCON 3), the engines would be running idle 24/7, at 2 minutes (DEFCON 2) there are pilots in the cockpit 24/7.
Then again, iirc the USAF only has "real" QRAs for NORAD and DC...
At 5 minutes (DEFCON 3), the engines would be running idle 24/7, at 2 minutes (DEFCON 2) there are pilots in the cockpit 24/7.
Then again, iirc the USAF only has "real" QRAs for NORAD and DC...
A question, what does QRA stand for? I know what QRF is, is QRA is the same thing for air force?
During East Timors troubles in 99, RAAF had F-111 pilots at combat level QRA's.
The F-111's were cycled up, the pilots spent their time in the cockpits waiting for a go signal. This was when there was concern that the Indons might have a shot at launching airstrikes on UN troops at Dili. Their job was to take off and attack Jakarta. Local air would have deployed from Darwin to intercept any Indon jets as they Hornets would have had sufficient warning to get up and go.
I'd add that the USN had air available locally (offshore) and they were also at QRA -15
Interesting insight into ET !! Can you elaborate any more on that ? I have not heard that before, but do not doubt it either. I would contest the fact that the USN had air abailability ? but purely going of what CDF had to say at the time, and in following years after ET, he was very insistant that there was no other country involvement in the initial stages and that it was an all Aussie start to the campaign ??
Thanks
At the time of ET there was also a Pitch Black Exercise underway. As you know this is the only full theatre event that we run with partners.
PB was cancelled and staged forces for the exercise were fast tracked to Darwin. USN assets which were tasked for PB "elected" to head for ET and stood off the coast near Dilli.
At the same time CINCPAC made a flying visit to Jakarta to have private discussions. The message and intent was clear - if the Indons had launched air against the forces going into Dilli, then everything would have escalated, and Canb was prepared to strike Jakarta to tell them to back off. The USN TF Commander at the time made it very clear that he was prepared to assist Australia in any capacity available.
In addition, there were US Army units that had photographs of their Loaches with military staff (early equivs of JTACS) sitting on the ET side of the border. This was also in their unit history and a few years back I posted the Unit links on SP to point out the "anomalies" in Cosgroves stance.
The public announcements might have been geared for public consumption as the US made it pretty clear that from their perspective, Australia was running point on this, and that even though it was a UN sanctioned event, Aust was seen as taking the tactical initiative and that we would retain C2 irrespective of what the UN "representation" was.
For comparaison purposes :
French AF has 3 QRA levels : 2, 7, 15min.
Air space protection is effective from 4 bases. On each are 2 planes dedicated to QRA. One plane is on QRA 7m, the other on QRA 15m. Every few hours the 2 pilots on alert switch their reponse time, since the one in QRA 7m already wears his G-pants. Each team (2 pilots/6mechs) stays on alert for 1 week.
During special events (2007 rugby world cup, G8, G20), QRA is set to 2 minutes. In this case, the pilot stays in the cockpit, belts on, for hours.
Note : 2, 7, 15 minutes is the time between the alert and wheels off.
French AF has 3 QRA levels : 2, 7, 15min.
Air space protection is effective from 4 bases. On each are 2 planes dedicated to QRA. One plane is on QRA 7m, the other on QRA 15m. Every few hours the 2 pilots on alert switch their reponse time, since the one in QRA 7m already wears his G-pants. Each team (2 pilots/6mechs) stays on alert for 1 week.
During special events (2007 rugby world cup, G8, G20), QRA is set to 2 minutes. In this case, the pilot stays in the cockpit, belts on, for hours.
Note : 2, 7, 15 minutes is the time between the alert and wheels off.
I'm guessing it depends on the command. In the Marines QRF during an f-x could be sleeping, or sitting there flak, kevlar, and rifle in hand.
winnyfield
New Member
Chances are that the first responders would be Air National Guard like on 9/11
What does QRF stand for? if i recall correctly during the Cold War a pair of USAF F-15A's were on constant alert with their engines running at Bitberg.
Interesting how history tends to repeat itself. Read somewhere that had the military situation on the ground worsened or escalated during the Confrontation, RAAF Canberra's and the RAF would have hit targets on Java.
One of the biggests concerns during the landings in East Timor was I believe not TNI-AU Hawks and F-16's deployed at Kupang but the TNI-AL's 2 Type 209 SSK's, one of which was detected by a RNZN Leander shadowing the INTERFET fleet.
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Canberras were long gone by ET, he was saying Canberra would strike Jakarta (Like Washington going to war against Iraq). the F-111s were on alert to strike targets.
yup, indo subs were stalking ships heading over to ET. well atleast until someone let slip there were 2 collins trolling in the area, then a large chunck of the indonesian navy was homeported
thats my uderstanding of it anyway, im sure gf or abe can tell us if i have got my facts straight
I meant that there were plans to strike Java with RAAF Canberras during the 'Confrontation' with Indonesia during the 60's and that history had repeated itself when the RAAF was ready to hit Java again, this time over the East Timor issue
. Off topic to this thread but it's interesting to speculate how successful an RAAF strike would have been given that it's success would have depended largely on the ability of ground base Indonesian radars to detect the F-111's at an early stage. Of course other factors would have come into play such as RAAF jamming, the lack of Indonesian SAM's [only a few batteries of Rapiers] , the F-111's going in at night and the fact that a number of Indonesian fighters had already been deployed close to East Timor. Had such a strike been conducted, it would not IMO have led to the Indonesians on East Timor agreeing to a cease hostilities.
Has the Aussie government or the RAN ever confirmed that Collins SSKs were deployed to East Timorise waters during the crisis? Then again I would be very suprised if they weren't.well atleast until someone let slip there were 2 collins trolling in the area, then a large chunck of the indonesian navy was homeported
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ahh sorry, i missunderstood