Royal Norwegian Air Force news and discussion
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longbow
New Member
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The 10 F-16's lined up on the strip. The detachment consists of 10 F-16MLU, one C-130J and some 180 personel. Quite a large force for the RNoAF, I hope there are some F-16's left to guard against curious Ru-air in the high north!
The 10 F-16's lined up on the strip. The detachment consists of 10 F-16MLU, one C-130J and some 180 personel. Quite a large force for the RNoAF, I hope there are some F-16's left to guard against curious Ru-air in the high north!
Haavarla
Active Member
Have any of you guys heard anything about Red Flag 09? The RNoAF sent 10 of their MLU'ed Vipers, with their Pantera and jamming-pods. Was it all mud-moving, or did they som AA-scenarios as well? I'm kind of curious of the F16-JHMCS-IRIS-T-combo!
Are mistaken the RNAF(Netherland) with the RoNAF(Norway)?
Netherlands Vipers are partisipating in this year Red Flag.
I could be wrong though, if so i've must have missed it all together..
Thanks
Mike Taylor
New Member
I have try and have a look at the dates, with the vRNZAF i have open since nov/dec last year and in that time no more people wants to join, i can only do so much, and your also thinking of vRNLAF which is danish not norwedigan.
Thanks
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Chopperjohn
New Member
how about the swedish airforce?
We all know that scandinavian countries have some advanced systems, how is the swedish airforce, is it any better than the norwegian airforce?
We all know that scandinavian countries have some advanced systems, how is the swedish airforce, is it any better than the norwegian airforce?
Todjaeger
Potstirrer
A couple of things to point out to a new member. Firstly, the thread topic is the Royal Norwegian Air Force... So if one wants to discuss something, discuss that. If a poster wants to discuss the Swedish Air Force instead, do so in the appropriate thread or start a new one if such a thread does not already exist. Secondly, here at DT vs. threads are not allowed or appreciated, as they too often have little to do with any real facts and more often rely upon fanboy attitudes and nationalistic fervour.
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Haavarla
Active Member
Nothing more than the regular statments longbow.Any inside information on the exercise Promo? It was mainly a joint Russian-Norwegian naval exercise, but also F-16 and Su-33's participated.
Any in the know?
Successful Norwegian-Russian naval exercises - BarentsObserver
Cooperation is the key to security and stability - BarentsObserver
I think it's pretty naive to think that one can have a large millitary procurement that's not highly political.
I put it to you, that when a country chooses to use a substancial amount of the state's budget on f.ex. a new airplane the first consideration is the political one: Does this plane fit a number of strictly political parameters. One of these parameters would likly be to make the millitary happy (which could also be done by buying something extra, increase budget, put painfull reforms on hold etc).
Ofcourse further down the line the technical expertize is important, and can likely veto the political process. f.ex. the technical expertize (the airforce) might say that given the choise between plane A or B, plane A cannot meet requirements and would be useless while B would do the job. In that situation the political level would probably be forced not to choose the plane A.
But if the millitary says; Well we like B better than A of a number of reasons, the politicians might have another number of reasons why A is best (f.ex. that it's home produced, cheaper or what ever).
Without saying a word on the cost-benefit of either the gripen or the JSF:
In the case of Norway and Denmark. It's a clear political advantage of the JSF that it's an american system that the americans are betting their hat on. Because both Norway (having a certain neighbour) and Denmark (with Greenland) are 100% dependent on the US for territorial security. And of that reason alone, DK and No aligns their defenses with the US (The, imho number one (political) reason for an american plane as the favoured one ).
It is a clear disadvantage for the gripen that it is a swedish plane, since sweden aren't relevant vis a vis the territorial security of neither Norway nor Denmark.
The gripen has a popular advantage over the JSF because the Norwegian and Danish public would like to buy a swedish plane - but that is secondary.
I put it to you, that when a country chooses to use a substancial amount of the state's budget on f.ex. a new airplane the first consideration is the political one: Does this plane fit a number of strictly political parameters. One of these parameters would likly be to make the millitary happy (which could also be done by buying something extra, increase budget, put painfull reforms on hold etc).
Ofcourse further down the line the technical expertize is important, and can likely veto the political process. f.ex. the technical expertize (the airforce) might say that given the choise between plane A or B, plane A cannot meet requirements and would be useless while B would do the job. In that situation the political level would probably be forced not to choose the plane A.
But if the millitary says; Well we like B better than A of a number of reasons, the politicians might have another number of reasons why A is best (f.ex. that it's home produced, cheaper or what ever).
Without saying a word on the cost-benefit of either the gripen or the JSF:
In the case of Norway and Denmark. It's a clear political advantage of the JSF that it's an american system that the americans are betting their hat on. Because both Norway (having a certain neighbour) and Denmark (with Greenland) are 100% dependent on the US for territorial security. And of that reason alone, DK and No aligns their defenses with the US (The, imho number one (political) reason for an american plane as the favoured one ).
It is a clear disadvantage for the gripen that it is a swedish plane, since sweden aren't relevant vis a vis the territorial security of neither Norway nor Denmark.
The gripen has a popular advantage over the JSF because the Norwegian and Danish public would like to buy a swedish plane - but that is secondary.
OldTex
Well-Known Member
It has been reported in Naval News that Norway is terminating its contract for 14 NH-90 helicopters. It was assessed that the NH-90 is not capable of meeting the requirements of the Norwegian Defence Force. This has been attributed to the inability to source spares for critical systems, including some for the ASW capability.
As these NH-90 were to replace the SAR Sea Kings and ASW Lynx there will be an urgent need for replacements.
As these NH-90 were to replace the SAR Sea Kings and ASW Lynx there will be an urgent need for replacements.
Sandhi Yudha
Well-Known Member
Norway immediately stops operating the NH90
Norway immediately stops operating the NH90 On 10 June 2022, the Norwegian Minister of Defence, Bjørn Arild Gram, officially announced that phasing in of the NH90 will be stopped a...
From which i understand Norway is not the first country which is disappointed by the NH90, if i am not wrong Australia and Sweden are also planning to retire the NH90 much earlier than planned.
It is just surprising that all those large and experienced helicopter/aerospace manufacturers, Agusta, Eurocopter, Fokker and Westland, are capable to create such a failed product.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
You can add LM- Sikorsky to your list. Canada’s CH-148 Cyclone hasn’t exactly been a raging success.Norway immediately stops operating the NH90
Norway immediately stops operating the NH90 On 10 June 2022, the Norwegian Minister of Defence, Bjørn Arild Gram, officially announced that phasing in of the NH90 will be stopped a...www.scramble.nl
From which i understand Norway is not the first country which is disappointed by the NH90, if i am not wrong Australia and Sweden are also planning to retire the NH90 much earlier than planned.
It is just surprising that all those large and experienced helicopter/aerospace manufacturers, Agusta, Eurocopter, Fokker and Westland, are capable to create such a failed product.
Redlands18
Well-Known Member
Yes Australia has already decided to dump the NH-90 TTH called MRH-90 in Australian service, with 12 MH-60R already ordered for the RAN and at least 40 Blackhawks(exact mix unknown but may include a SPECOPS version) for the Army. Australia has also dumped the Tiger in favour of E model Apache's.Norway immediately stops operating the NH90
Norway immediately stops operating the NH90 On 10 June 2022, the Norwegian Minister of Defence, Bjørn Arild Gram, officially announced that phasing in of the NH90 will be stopped a...
From which i understand Norway is not the first country which is disappointed by the NH90, if i am not wrong Australia and Sweden are also planning to retire the NH90 much earlier than planned.
It is just surprising that all those large and experienced helicopter/aerospace manufacturers, Agusta, Eurocopter, Fokker and Westland, are capable to create such a failed product.
Sandhi Yudha
Well-Known Member
Thank you, i didn't knew that.You can add LM- Sikorsky to your list. Canada’s CH-148 Cyclone hasn’t exactly been a raging success.
After searching on the internet about the S-92/CH-148, it seems to be a complete nightmare program on th level of NH-90 or even worse.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
To be fair, the S-92 is a decent helicopter but the military version H-92, not so much. The H-92 was heavily modified to become the CH-148. It was a paper design when ordered and Canada will likely be the only customer. The EH101 was what should have been ordered, an actual flying design, unlike the H-92 and NH-90.
Sandhi Yudha
Well-Known Member
Yes ive read somewhere that Canada planned to order the EH101, but it was canceled by the government.
Why was the EH101 order canceled? Financial reasons, political pressure from the US, or internal political reasons?
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
The EH101 was ordered by the Mulroney government. An election changed the government with Chrétien becoming PM, who, IMO, was even worse than junior. He cancelled the EH101 order which required a $500 million penalty. Purely political.
It was announced today that Norway is making a quite large order of AMRAAM-D -- 5 billion NOK ($502 million).
www.fma.no
This is the largest weapons/munition order ever placed by Norway. According to some sources the unit cost is around 1 million, so this should be approx. 500 AMRAAM-D.
Norway will ultimately have 48 Norwegian based F-35 (+4 US based dedicated for training only), so 500 AMRAAM-D seems a bit over the top to me, especially considering the poor state of other parts of the Norwegian armed forces. Norway has a number of AMRAAM today. Perhaps some of the current ones will be donated to Ukraine when the -D start to arrive? This could perhaps explain why we order so many?
Anyway, great news. I am just hoping we will match this by making significant orders of also AIM-9X, NSM/JSM, Stormbreakers, artillery shells, torpedoes, GMLRS missiles, etc. etc.
Signerte rekordavtale for missiler til F-35
Gro Jære, direktør Forsvarsmateriell, signerte i dag en avtale med amerikanske myndigheter om kjøp av AMRAAM-D luft-til-luft missiler for bruk på norske F-35 kampfly verdt cirka fem milliarder kroner.
www.fma.no
This is the largest weapons/munition order ever placed by Norway. According to some sources the unit cost is around 1 million, so this should be approx. 500 AMRAAM-D.
Norway will ultimately have 48 Norwegian based F-35 (+4 US based dedicated for training only), so 500 AMRAAM-D seems a bit over the top to me, especially considering the poor state of other parts of the Norwegian armed forces. Norway has a number of AMRAAM today. Perhaps some of the current ones will be donated to Ukraine when the -D start to arrive? This could perhaps explain why we order so many?
Anyway, great news. I am just hoping we will match this by making significant orders of also AIM-9X, NSM/JSM, Stormbreakers, artillery shells, torpedoes, GMLRS missiles, etc. etc.
OldTex
Well-Known Member
The order for the AMRAAM-D by Norway will most likely, in my opinion, cover not only the F-16/F-35 fighters but also the NASAMS also operated by RNoAF. It may also allow for existing AMRAAMs in Norwegian stocks to be provided either to Ukraine or transferred with the F-16s being sold to Romania (to replace their Mig-21 Lancers).