Malaysian Army/Land forces discussions
- Thread starter weasel1962
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Mr Ignorant
New Member
PT91, T72, T90, who cares ??? Same circus, different clowns. Can someone or some Moderator please bust me down to Private??? I'm non military, so that would make sense. THanks
Hi ggk, glad you found your way to defencetalk.com. 
But well, I know you already, but the other users would surely like to get to know you, too. So how about posting a short introduction of yourself in the new members introduction thread?
But well, I know you already, but the other users would surely like to get to know you, too. So how about posting a short introduction of yourself in the new members introduction thread?
Mr Ignorant
New Member
Group Gerak Khas, selamat datang ke Forum Defencetalk. Silakan
Mr Ignorant
New Member
Well, currently there is another very serious issue emerging in the Armed Forces, that is the replacement for the Radpanzer Condor vehicles. We have about 450 of this type, and dare I say, that sounds pretty hefty in numbers. If a replacement is found what should it be, Strykers and LAV iVs?
And what about the Rooikats (105mm) for the MAF recon groups?? SInce we use similar vehicles of mounting guns?
Yeah, the Condor 'n Sibmas replacement is another pressing issue. But it wont be funded before 2011. There's no need to replace all 600+ Condor/Sibmas that were once in service. Part of the capabilites has been replaced by the K-200 (MIFV), ACV-300 and PT-91M. Malaysia has already issued the intent to buy 98 APCs, of which 82 will be equipped with an autocannon. Different vehicles were already tested (has been discussed here before, a few pages back).
@ggk: Yes, not so many pictures here, only talk talk talk.:
@ggk: Yes, not so many pictures here, only talk talk talk.
:GGK, you said you work in an architect firm? in KL? Which particular one?
@DavidDCM : Are BMPs a possible choice? They're an interesting IFV series. A bit cramped in the rear compartment, but it gets the job done. The BMP-3 really kicks ass though. A 100mm gun on an APC. Who would've ever thought of that.... (Stryker MGS doesn't count!)
@DavidDCM : Are BMPs a possible choice? They're an interesting IFV series. A bit cramped in the rear compartment, but it gets the job done. The BMP-3 really kicks ass though. A 100mm gun on an APC. Who would've ever thought of that.... (Stryker MGS doesn't count!)
Not really, the T 90 is the best in terms of protection for a similar price to the pt91. So the better choice is the T 90. The western equipments on the pt91, can also be fitted to the T90 if there is a request. The Pt91 was probably chosen by whoever who made the decision coz its name "91" indicated a higher value to the T 90. :lul
Mr Ignorant
New Member
It's a moot point. Kor Armor DiRaja gets the PT 91. It's not a bad tank after all, as it is still a Tank. I've read page after page on the T72 series and it's variants, so I am not going to change my mind.
Can someone explain the difference between a welded turret, and a cast turret? That particular point keeps cropping up when discussing the T72 and T90. Also, a brief explanation on the M shaped turret would help to?
Please shed some light on my ignorance. THanks
Can someone explain the difference between a welded turret, and a cast turret? That particular point keeps cropping up when discussing the T72 and T90. Also, a brief explanation on the M shaped turret would help to?
Please shed some light on my ignorance. THanks
i have my own practice
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With the Russians going to a welded turret they have increased the base armor protection level by having additional turret volume to use better laminated armor protection packages, I have read sources that state with the welded turret with some of these packages such as Kaktus could push this vehicle up to a 50 ton weight class, they could also be close to this by using Relikt also. Thus with the cheaper maunfacturing process inregards to welding along with better base armor protection this was a smart move on Russia`s part, they have been tessting the welded turret design for at least a couple of decades so they have known for quite some time of the potential of this design.
I've been quite ignorant on that matter as well, although I have been curious. Does western tank designers use cast or welded turret? What type does T 72,T80 and Pt 91 use?
As far as kaktus go, I thought it was dead along with Black Eagle, and that the future is Relikt?
All modern tank turret designs are of welded construction.
T-72 and early T-90 have cast turrets.
PT-91 has cast turret.
T-80 has cast turret with the exception of Ukrainian T-84 and T-80UD sold to Pakistan.
Even though later/future T-80 upgrades such as Black Eagle have been scrapped for production Russia can still gain from some of the technology potential and incorporate it into the T-90, you will find that when they decided to produce T-90 series that they did take some of the components from the T-80U and use them. Alot of Russian top brass during the decision making between T-90 and T-80U on what design to keep felt that their best bet was to stay with the T-80 platform, for once I think that they have been proven wrong and Russia took the best approach. Relikt and Kaktus are here to stay and I will not be surprised when we find out that they are already using it.
Another reason why the choice of Pt 91 is a very poor choice for Malaysia.
And I was reading another discussion on ERA's on another forum and it hit me. I think while the Kaktus seems to disappear with the Black Eagle, i believe we will see it again, with the T 95. I remember seeing sketches of proposed unmmaned turrent of T 95, and they have the Black Eagle style integrated kaktus ERA onto the Hull. As for Relikt, I think it is meant as an upgrade to T 72/90 tank that was using K5 ERA.
Also I found this interesting site on protection, but it is in Russian.
I'd like to show this diagram though. While it is in Russian, it is easily understandable. It shows the Protection level of different tanks, Nato and Russia. Also the Sabot rounds, belonging to NATO and Russia. Those in Blue indicate NATO, and those in RED indicate Russia.