More T-72s for Iraq?!
- Thread starter Feanor
- Start date
Iranian tank strength is listed as follows:
160 M48
180 M60A1
200 Cheiftains
75 T-62
450 T-72
256 T-54/55
200 Type 59
240 Type 69
100 Zulifgar series
Factor in that most likely 50% of the western tanks are junk due to lack of spare parts. Zulifgar production is rather slow and I would state that the FCS and turret design is based on Chinese technology.
Tanks
Iran has a lot more tanks then I thought they did can I assume a good portion of them are near Iraq?
Is there any outside source besides Iraq/Iran that I could read about tank battles between these two country's? Was any press or other news sources allowed to cover the fighting at anytime?
Thanks in advance
Iran has a lot more tanks then I thought they did can I assume a good portion of them are near Iraq?
Like you mention the above tanks might be in bad shape.
Is there any outside source besides Iraq/Iran that I could read about tank battles between these two country's? Was any press or other news sources allowed to cover the fighting at anytime?
Thanks in advance
Hi Steven,
I have a good book that I use for training reference on this subject, the book is called The Lessons of Modern War volume 2, this book is 600 pages long and covers solely the Iran-Iraq war. Authors are Anthony H. Cordesman and Abraham R. Wagner. This book is also endorsed by the U.S Army.
They actually have upgrade packages for all of their tanks at the current time, I was told that those Chieftains are in bad shape though, the ones seen are always during parade times. Did you notice that the T-54 in the photo is sporting a rifled 105mm.
Yes, I did, but it's not like a 105 mm is something to be overtly impressed by. I believe you that the Western tanks are in a poor state. On the other hand, shouldn't it be possible to come up with homemade spare parts for them. Iran's industry is not so backward at least and they don't give a bleh on copyright anyway. But maybe they simply have no interest in this, and rather prefer to concentrate on Russian tanks and their Zulfiqar. The latters number is given as "around 100" since several years. Didn't they produce any more of them in the last 2, 3 years?
Yes, they have managed to fabricate some of the components needed but alot of it comes from the black market, they like parading their western designed equipment around as a propaganda tool, most frontline equipment is of Russian design with the Chinese breaking ground in some areas.
I reckon the Iranians have replaced the parts of tanks with locally made ones. Iran interesting has locally built Cobra copy, if the majority of its parts are locally built, I cannot see them having too much trouble with tanks. Plus as Eckherl has already detailed there is a black market out there, of which "unpatriotic citizens" are selling the tech on for top dollar, euro and pound.
Edit. Also as I stated in T 90 thread, a panoramic Hunter Killer site would not hurt.
Edit. Also as I stated in T 90 thread, a panoramic Hunter Killer site would not hurt.
I surely believe that it is possible for them to build the needed Chieftain parts.
But is it worth the cost. Doing that is surely going to cost more than just getting the spare parts for a growing number of russian and chinese equipment.
And while it may not be possible to get a halway decent attack helicopter, so copying one is worth the cost, getting new tanks out of non-western sources is defenitely possible and might be a much better solution.
But is it worth the cost. Doing that is surely going to cost more than just getting the spare parts for a growing number of russian and chinese equipment.
And while it may not be possible to get a halway decent attack helicopter, so copying one is worth the cost, getting new tanks out of non-western sources is defenitely possible and might be a much better solution.
Iranians like many countries are striving to replace foreign content in their military's. It might be expensive at start but eventually the machines they installed and engineers trained will eventually make their own designs. Thats the theory, many countries have followed this route and have succeeded.
Iranians and others, serious about building their own industry should try to build the easy stuff and import the high tech stuff from abroad. Like the latest Iranian tank, most likely the hi tech stuff has been bought from abroad like FCS.
Would it also be worth the Iranians to produce 120mm bullets for a few hundred tanks.:unknown
Iran has been cooperating with China inregards to newer FCS technology and armor protection levels.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #36
Could you post a source please?
This has been common knowledge now for quite some time in the armor community, if you have a issue with what I write then ask questions inregards to the topic and stop asking for links, you can do your own research and debate anything that I write, I will not think any less of you, I enjoy the debate just as long as it stays friendly. I think that there is alot of individuals who have under estimated China`s capabilities and show negative opinions inregards to them, this may end up bitting some countries right in the ass sometime down the road. China has worked with Iran on many different defense projects stemming from tactical vehicles to missile and Radar technologies, Russia and the U.S have a growing concern with the amount of countries in that regoin who have turned to the Chinese for assistance in weapons research and procurments, the list is growing and with China needing natural resources the list of friends in that part of the world will continue to grow. Is there any defense professionals who lurk on this site who want to debate what I just wrote and tell me that I am full of sh_t. @ROCK45 sent me a private message with a decent article on China selling loads of artillery in that part of the world, they are actually doing better in this field than the U.S and Russia combined.
@ Rock45,
Take a look at what Jordan has purchased from China in recent times, I forgot to add them to the list that we were discussing earlier.
@ Rock45,
Take a look at what Jordan has purchased from China in recent times, I forgot to add them to the list that we were discussing earlier.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #38
My apologies, I just have made a habit of asking for a source when I come across a piece of information I haven't encountered before. I did not mean to offend you.
You did not offend me, if I came across with a attitude then I apologize.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #40
Hehe. We're apologizing to each other now.
:Anyways, out of curiosity, does the Iraqi army already have a military doctrine?