Is the R-73 (AA-11 Archer) a LOAL missile?

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Ozzy Blizzard

New Member
Chuncho said:
Guys, can someone clarify me the question?
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AFAIK no it's not. You need an INS or the like for a missile to have true LOAL capability in addition to having the smarts, as an example the more advanced Python 4 does not have LOAL capability but Python 5 (in some ways more capable than even AIM-9X) does.

There is a distinct difference between HOBS and LOAL, i don't think AIM-9x provides a LOAL capability.
 
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Totoro

New Member
Isn't some indian funded further development of r-73, which to date only indian AF is using, LOAL? IIRC, there were some reports about tests where the engaged targets were behind the launch airplane. Does anyone have more about that?

As for aim9x, again, IIRC, current block is fully capable of locking on after launch, hardware wise, but the current software doesn't give it that option. I do remember there was a claim next block will have that ability enabled.
 
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nevidimka

New Member
The R-73, which was put in service in the 80's does not have LOAL as the Russians never stated this, but I'm unsure about the R-74.
 
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tphuang

Super Moderator
nevidimka said:
The R-73, which was put in service in the 80's does not have LOAL as the Russians never stated this, but I'm unsure about the R-74.
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none of the recent missiles they advertised have it, but I'm sure it will be on their new generation missile that they said is planned for su-35 and then 5th gen fighters.
 
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Mercurius

New Member
The R-73 and the R-74 do not have LOAL; to the best of my knowledge this is not expected until the follow-on izdeliye 760, which will be the first short-range Russian air-to-air missile to have an inertial subsystem as part of its guidance.

Mercurius Cantabrigiensis
 
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Mercurius

New Member
Feanor said:
Do you by any chance have a link to info. on the Izdelie 760?
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The only source I’m aware of was a paper presented by Vympel at a Russian technical conference in 2006, but which was almost immediately retrospectively classified (so I was told). I’ve heard a rumour that a summary of the paper was posted on a Russian enthusiast website, but was taken down after a few days.

It seems that the izdeliye 760 is a derivative of the K-74M, with an improved IR seeker, an inertial control system allowing LOAL operation, a datalink receiver for target updates, a rocket motor with a longer burn time, and a physical cross section small enough to allow internal carriage in a weapons bay. Trials were expected to start in 2006, with development ending in 2010.

Since 2006 there has been no further news of the programme that I am aware of.


Mercurius Cantabrigiensis
 
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macman

New Member
There was some info posted a while back about the latest generation of Russian missiles, including the izdeliye 760, in the Russia & CIS Observer,:


GosMKB Vympel, Russia's leading air-to-air missile design bureau, is busy evolving a full spectrum of missiles for the PAK FA, ranging from short-range weapons to long-range variants. In 2010, Vympel expects to complete its development of the short-range Izdeliye 760 missile — which is a significantly modernized version of the R-73 weapon, outfitted with an inertial flight control system and course correction receiver, improved rocket engine and with new multi-mode infrared seeker. The Izdeliye 760 is expected to be a close counterpart to the Western-built ASRAAM and Sidewinder AIM-9X missiles.

Three years later, the new-generation K-MD short range missile (also to be designated the Izdeliye 300) is to be operational. When compared to Izdeliye 760, the new missile will have longer range and will be capable of being launched from any direction; it will be also more resistant to jamming. The K-MD will be fitted with a new imaging infrared seeker enabling identification of target according to memorized images. The seeker's lock-on range will be two times greater than the seeker for the Izdeliye 760 missile. A new adaptive warhead will be introduced, and the missile's control will be performed with aerodynamic surfaces, as well as a thrust-vector engine nozzle.

Russia's most modern medium-range air-to-air missile is the R-77 (Izdeliye 170) and its export derivative RVV-AE (Izdeliye 190). A phased modernization of this weapon, designated the K-77-1 (Izdeliye 170-1), is now being tested. In addition, the K-77M (Izdeliye 180) missile is currently under development as a second step in the R-77's modernization. The most visible change in the Izdeliye 180's external appearance compared to the R-77/RVV-AE is replacement of its latticework fins by more common flat aerodynamic control planes. This reduces aerodynamic drag and cuts down on the radar cross-section. The missile will be fitted with a modernized active radar seeker and new double pulse solid-propellant engine. Its maximum range will be 2-3.5 times more than the Izdeliye 170 (R-77) missile, depending on the launch altitude. The Izdeliye 180 is expected to be better than the AMRAAM AIM-120C7 missile, and equal to its successor versions, with a service-ready date targeted for 2010.
A future medium-range air-to-air missile as a follow-on to the Izdeliye 180 also is in development, but no additional information has yet to be released about this weapon.
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More info at:
http://www.ato.ru/rus/cis/archive/17-2007/def/def3/
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
As far as I know they're not even visible on the horizon at the moment. Allegedly some new munitions will enter service with the PAK-FA. That's all I've heard.
 
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