I doubt the general public cares enough about the RAAF to allow this kind of deal
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Royal Australian Air Force [RAAF] News, Discussions and Updates
Interesting article about the F-22. Makes a lot of sense to me. While I'm not sure about the argument that an F-22-like aircraft is not needed at all, I certainly can't see how ~200 F-22s can replace the huge number of other fighters (i.e. F-15s) in service, it just seems like a crazy concept to me.
I'm against this, security isn't all about the military, it's also a political topic. I don't see such a concept keeping our neighbours on our side. That's even if the US considered that a fair deal to start with.
Hey all,
Being a general RAAF thread, would anyone be able to tell me the company/organization that operates the Search & Rescue helicopters at the RAAF bases? The 'copter at RAAF Pearce is apparently from a Canadian company (or so the Air Force Cadet's instructors told me)
Being a general RAAF thread, would anyone be able to tell me the company/organization that operates the Search & Rescue helicopters at the RAAF bases? The 'copter at RAAF Pearce is apparently from a Canadian company (or so the Air Force Cadet's instructors told me)
CHC Helicopters. They have a large presence in Australia with offshore mining/exploration ops as well. They have helos at Pearce, East Sale, Williamtown & Townsville.
I was particularly pleased to see Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston given another term. The next three years will be vital in ensuring that steady progress is made with the ADF's procurement program and the continuity at the top provided by his re-appointment should prove invaluable.
Tas
The VCDF is not mucking about either. He's already making his presence felt....
Stryker001
Banned Member
Out of the countries to be given, an exemption for foreign sales of the F-22 by Congress would be Israel. Unlike Japan and Australia, Israel faces a direct threat and an extremely volatile region. China, other than her black budget is not a direct conventional threat, requiring foreign sales. It is part of American foreign policy in the Middle East for Israel to possess superior capabilities.
I believe if Congress allows sales it would be on a case by case basis, limited numbers. It will keep the production line going as the US Air Force want. In the future as the arms race continues in Asia, the threat level may qualify foreign sales to Australia and Japan.
Some parts of Congress are Republican Wayne
Just my opinion
I believe if Congress allows sales it would be on a case by case basis, limited numbers. It will keep the production line going as the US Air Force want. In the future as the arms race continues in Asia, the threat level may qualify foreign sales to Australia and Japan.
Some parts of Congress are Republican Wayne
Just my opinion
The US won't sell F-22 to Israel, they let the Chinese look at their F-16's once and that means the US can't trust them as much as people would like, besides Israel can't afford them, the US would have to foot most of the bill for them.
Todjaeger
Potstirrer
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #1,011
Not to mention there is still the requirement of changes to the law allowing money to be allocated to process the needed FMS documents. As has been repeated in a number of different threads regarding F-22 sales, there are significant political and legal hurdles to overcome before the F-22 can be sold to a foreign country. Once these hurdles are overcome, then the normal aircraft procurement hurdles (costs, support, training, etc) would then need to be met for another country to acquire the F-22.
I do not see Australia being allowed to purchase the F-22, even in exchange for a US base on Australian soil. This has, IMV, little to do with Australia being a trusted US ally (or not trusted, if not allowed to purchase). Rather, it involves the ramifications such a sale would have on relationships and interests in different parts of the world.
Then, there is the whole issue of whether or not such a sale would be of interest to Australia. The F-22 would certainly be useful to the RAAF, but it is questionable if it is/would as useful as other possible designs.
-Cheers
The F-35 is advertized as "stealthy", and Israel, Australia and other allies are by no means prohibited from ordering them. The F-22 is also "stealthy", but has other capabilities that even closest US allies should not be easily given. So, how good is F-35, and can it be a subsitute for F-22 in Australian context?
The F-22 and F-35 serve and fulfill different roles. What is the requirement to have the F-22??
Do we need them? No
Would they be nice to have? Of Course
Do they justify the impact on the rest of the procurement budget? Only if they fulfill a threat matrix requirement etc...
It's pretty apparent that australia is not prohibited from buying the JSF as we are a build partner.
As for Israel? I seriously doubt it. Israel is still on the cautious list of a number of countries due to her commercial frivolity with respect to Lavi, Harpy and some ewarfare issues. There is no way that she will get access to the F-22 in the current climate. There's probably less if the Dems get in.
You buy platforms to suit your national doctrine which is developed in conjunction with a threat matrix. You don't buy them becuase they're the best and you think that you have an automatic right of access. Partner privilege brings other benefits way beyond the single platform capability of just the F-22.
A
Aussie Digger
Guest
Have these Countries got US$65 BILLION and 25 years AND the research and manufacturing capacity to do so?
What about the experience in building VLO aircraft?
Stop talking rubbish. The chances of ANYONE building an "F-22" counterpart in years to come is nonsense.
So what if they build their own?? what has that got to do with the F-22 relevance for australia?
is japan a threat? (we train and exercise with them regularly and have since 1951)
is china a threat? if they are how and where is their logistics footprint \
going to be able to support and sustain a push into our region of response?
are you reading Air Power Australia? where are the Su-xx in our ASEAN members going to threaten australia? what systems capability do they have.
for the last time - its about systems and force cohersion, its got nothing to do with single platforms.\
From what I have heard from Lockheed workers in Fort Worth, the F-35As are better than anything flying considerably except for the twice as costly Raptors. This includes being better than all of the F-16s and F/A-18s and F-15s. The F-35Bs will outshine the Harriers significantly. This is from friends who aren't so happy with the big shots at the top of Lockheed. Their honest opinions.
Would you think these same workers who built F-16s and F-111s at the same General Dynamics plant in Fort Worth would know their stuff? After a fly-off with Boeing, and a long development program.
If you think you are buying a dog, sorry. You have been fooled again if you pass over the F-35. Yes, they are still in the testing days, but already the aircraft is better. You can't miss!! Its a no brainer.....
Frankly, I am more worried about its final price than its performance. As I was driving home earlier today for a dental appointment, I got off work early, I heard another sonic boom from a Lightning II. My eyes can tell the difference between a Falcon and a Lightning II.
Yes, it is great to live near Fort Worth, Texas....
Would you think these same workers who built F-16s and F-111s at the same General Dynamics plant in Fort Worth would know their stuff? After a fly-off with Boeing, and a long development program.
If you think you are buying a dog, sorry. You have been fooled again if you pass over the F-35. Yes, they are still in the testing days, but already the aircraft is better. You can't miss!! Its a no brainer.....
Frankly, I am more worried about its final price than its performance. As I was driving home earlier today for a dental appointment, I got off work early, I heard another sonic boom from a Lightning II. My eyes can tell the difference between a Falcon and a Lightning II.
Yes, it is great to live near Fort Worth, Texas....
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IIRC, our nearest neighbour, Indonesia has 2 x Su-30 and 2 x Su-27 with few weapons and little support and operational infrastructure. It hopes to get another 6 -8. Hardly a threat against the RAAF even if it also gains new weapons, control and reporting systems, airborne early warning and control units, etc, none of which appear likely to happen soon!
Tas
And around we go again... it's de ja vu all over again! :hitwall