India moving closer to Israel????

[Schumacher]

India is simply being 'used' by the great powers to weaken its long standing partnership with Russia as well as a propped up puppet against China's rising power. Everyone knows the Non-Aligned status that India always claimed was bogus and the Western powers are well aware that they can encourage India to switch teams.

There's indeed debate even within India how much they should abandon the non-aligned status, which has gained them much international respect in the past but little else, & become US's deputy.
There are reports that Rice & Negroponte have been going around the world telling many that India is now firmly in the the US camp.
PM Lee of Singapore noted at the recent Shangri-La dialogue that he thought India was not likely to want to become US's deputy. Personally, I think India will become one soon. They'll probably think what's the loss of some respect compared to practical goodies, like arms, of becoming US's deputy ?

 

[nero]

Please explain how offering F-18F superhornets is throwing junk at India.

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i was talking about the navy , not the airforce

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[kams]

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i was talking about the navy , not the airforce

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and which LPD did Russia offer to India which was rejected?

 

[swerve]

Wow

India buys/looks at some weapons systems from western countries and tries to establish a better relationship with some of those countries and all of a sudden they are being tricked and taken advantage of, how many weapons platforms has Russia been able to off load on India and continue to do so. I think you will see that western countries only have a small slice of that pie.

Off the top of my head, India has bought at various times the following western products, in large quantities -
AMX-13, Centurion, Vijayanta (licence-built)
Leander frigates, 2 second-hand aircraft carriers, all its landing ships (licence-built) prior to the Trenton deal.
Vampire, Hunter, Mystere IV, Gnat, Ajeet (licence-built & locally-modified Gnat), Jaguar (mostly licence-built), Mirage 2000, Canberra
Assorted British artillery in the early years, Bofors 155 mm in the 1980s.

The USA hasn't had a slice of that pie, but W. Europe has had a fair bit.

 

[eckherl]

Off the top of my head, India has bought at various times the following western products, in large quantities -
AMX-13, Centurion, Vijayanta (licence-built)
Leander frigates, 2 second-hand aircraft carriers, all its landing ships (licence-built) prior to the Trenton deal.
Vampire, Hunter, Mystere IV, Gnat, Ajeet (licence-built & locally-modified Gnat), Jaguar (mostly licence-built), Mirage 2000, Canberra
Assorted British artillery in the early years, Bofors 155 mm in the 1980s.

The USA hasn't had a slice of that pie, but W. Europe has had a fair bit.

Yes - but it seems like alot of the frontline equipment is coming out of Russia with newer equipment being purchased from Russia in terms of ground combat vehicles and aircraft. What is India looking at currently for possible weapons purchases from Western Europe or the U.S. Also I thought that they were looking at possibly adding more naval assetts purchased from Russia, is this true.

 

[kams]

Yes - but it seems like alot of the frontline equipment is coming out of Russia with newer equipment being purchased from Russia in terms of ground combat vehicles and aircraft. What is India looking at currently for possible weapons purchases from Western Europe or the U.S. Also I thought that they were looking at possibly adding more naval assetts purchased from Russia, is this true.

Please do bear in mind that during Cold war, India received many things from then USSR at 'friendly' prices, like Kashin class destroyers, Mig-21, 23, 27s, T-55, T-72's. Whenever India could afford something western she bought them in good numbers - eg Jaguars, Harriers etc. Heck look at IN submarines - Kilos, U209 and now Scorpenes.

Russia continues to offer some great systems which are denied by western govt. such as Cruise missiles with ToT - Brahmos. Su30 deal with great deal of customization is another item.

Estimated value of products under development with Russia is around $10 billion. Similarly many projects are underway with Israel.

Apart from USA, all other major weapon exporters have managed to get a slice of Indian market. Now if we believe the latest reports that India-US nuclear deal is through, US will enter Indian defence markey in a big way.

 

[eckherl]

@Kams and @Swerve

As always good information, I figured that Russia had a firm hand with weapons purchases with India.

Is their anything big that India is currently working with the U.S in regards to purchasing. It looks like the nuke deal between the U.S and India is a done deal, at least that is what the American people are being told.

 

[mysterious]

Now if we believe the latest reports that India-US nuclear deal is through, US will enter Indian defence markey in a big way.

And make sure India follows 'guidelines' handed down to it for such deals to be fruitful.

 

[kams]

And make sure India follows 'guidelines' handed down to it for such deals to be fruitful.

I guess in line with F-16 deal you guys had ehh?

In any case State department issued 3 line press release which just said 'the deal will be presented to respective governments for Final review'.


Coming to more serious question of eckherl, major apart from a squadron of C-130Js, no new deals have been signed b/w India and USA.

Major items on India's shopping list are,

India Army: 155 mm towed, Wheeled and Tracked artillary systems - US $ 6 billion.

190 Light utility helicopters - US$ 550 million. - as per the latest news reports, Bell may get another chance.

IAF - MRCA - US$ 10 billion

Indian Navy- MPA - Boeing P-8 is one of the contender, 7 frigates.

There are many others, mainly under joint development program with Russians and Israelis.

Biggest money spinner as a result of this nuke deal may well turn out to be GE and Westinghouse.

 

[horizon]

Poor People are dying with hunger, richer are buying costly electronic toys,

Manufacturing for necessity is different issue. A quality of health with character & moral is better than crippled body & brain. If Gandhi had been alive, story would have been different. Isn't it?

 

[aaaditya]

I guess in line with F-16 deal you guys had ehh?

In any case State department issued 3 line press release which just said 'the deal will be presented to respective governments for Final review'.


Coming to more serious question of eckherl, major apart from a squadron of C-130Js, no new deals have been signed b/w India and USA.

Major items on India's shopping list are,

India Army: 155 mm towed, Wheeled and Tracked artillary systems - US $ 6 billion.

190 Light utility helicopters - US$ 550 million. - as per the latest news reports, Bell may get another chance.

IAF - MRCA - US$ 10 billion

Indian Navy- MPA - Boeing P-8 is one of the contender, 7 frigates.

There are many others, mainly under joint development program with Russians and Israelis.

Biggest money spinner as a result of this nuke deal may well turn out to be GE and Westinghouse.

boeing p8i mma is the favourite ,i dont see india going for the a319 being offered by eads ,since there is no adequate maintainence infrastructure for that aircraft in the country,maybe a320 or a321 if offered but as of now boeing is the favourite.

 

[RubiconNZ]

boeing p8i mma is the favourite

What are the required numbers for the project?
Cheers

 

[aaaditya]

What are the required numbers for the project?
Cheers

as of now the requiement is for 8 aircrafts, but i wont be surprised if this number further increases ,india may want to acquire upto 18 of these aircrafts in the near future as a replacement for all the il38 mays and all the tu-142 bears.

 

[RubiconNZ]

as of now the requiement is for 8 aircrafts, but i wont be surprised if this number further increases, India may want to acquire upto 18 of these aircrafts in the near future as a replacement for all the il38 mays and all the tu-142 bears.

Thanks mate If 18 aircraft were to be purchased they would have a very effective impact on patrolling the Indian Ocean for both defensive and rescue/disaster relief operations.

 

[Izzy1]

P-8 (if delivered in full-configuration) would also offer India an over-land, Air-Ground Surveillance capability that is rumored to exceed the performance of the E-8C JSTARS.

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/p8-poseidon-mma-longrange-maritime-patrol-and-more-02980/#platform

Akin to the RAF's forthcoming Nimrod MRA.4, Poseidon P-8 promises expanded multi-role mission capability that may prove too tempting to dismiss.

 

[funtz]

well there are many aspects to the Indian Israeli relationship but I am better off discussing them in an economic forum.

staying specifically on India Israel military ties on a military discussion forum , these relation are here to stay as the increasing costs of modern military equipment, r&d sector have made it imperative that nations find partners, and Indian Israeli aspirations match perfectly.

Israel and India(one of the largest Muslim populations in the world) it is not going to be easy.

 

[pra3torian]

talking abt the India and Israel partnership. I need to know how closely the RAW is working with Mossad? can anyone plz share their knowledge on this..

 

[funtz]

they probably could, but then they will have to kill you.
ok sorry for that lame joke i know, but there it was and i had to take the shot

 

[funtz]

Well after your question i went through a some online material, try the search urself.

This one was interesting
http://www.rense.com/general25/team.htm

well if raw or mossad have managed to infiltrate Pakistan in any way they really need to be encouraged with a lot of funds.

it is true that these two intelligence agencies have and will continue to help each other.

 

[SABRE]

lol ..

Mod: pra3torian; the forum is out of my jurisdiction but another needless oneliner (in your case one word) from you & I'll report you. I recommend you edit your post or ask admin or concerned mod to delete it.