US Artillery Development

Artyengineer

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Canadian M777

I know those 6 weapons very well, I personally oversaw there total build, acceptance testing and final inspections. Was a good feeling when they had their very first operational shots a few months back.
 

Artyengineer

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long live usa said:
germany's new mobile howitser was most impressive from what i saw better than the crusader
The PzH2000 is a very impressive piece of equipment, however it is very big and pretty heavy, not suitable for todays world of rapid deployment.

Crusader if fully developed would have surpassed the PzH 2000 in terms of rate of fire and automation, it was only going to have a 3 man crew. It would have been capable of 12 rounds a minute and carrying out an 8 round MRSI (Multiple Round Simultaneous Impact) Mission. But it would have been even larger and heavier than the PzH2000. Thats the reason it got cancelled, it no longer fitted in to the doctrine and requiremnts of the US Army
 

long live usa

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yes when i saw only 2 of those things fire about ten rounds fell on a ridge line at basically the same time it was very impressive,im am also excited about the us army and marine corps getting there M777A1 ultra light field howitsers!!!:) :usa
 

Artyengineer

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long live usa said:
yes when i saw only 2 of those things fire about ten rounds fell on a ridge line at basically the same time it was very impressive,im am also excited about the us army and marine corps getting there M777A1 ultra light field howitsers!!!:) :usa
Where did you get the chance to see the PzH2000 in operation?
 

gf0012-aust

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Artyengineer said:
Where did you get the chance to see the PzH2000 in operation?
Lucky bugger if he has. I've only seen the footage of it "at work" when I was at the 2004 Land Warfare Conf in Oz. Also got to see the corporate doco of the K9 playing in the dirt.

The Sth Koreans were getting a lot of attention from some of the snr army guys.
 

Whiskyjack

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gf0012-aust said:
Lucky bugger if he has. I've only seen the footage of it "at work" when I was at the 2004 Land Warfare Conf in Oz. Also got to see the corporate doco of the K9 playing in the dirt.

The Sth Koreans were getting a lot of attention from some of the snr army guys.
I have seen the PzH 2000 turret on the MLRS Chassis, this model is being developed for light operations, deployable on A400, very similar specs, here is the link if you are interested.

http://www.army-technology.com/projects/artillery/
 

Waylander

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I really like the PzH2000 MLRS mix.
For fast airlift in small numbers it should be one of the best solutions. The same performance in terms of fire speed and accuracy like the PzH 2000. And for fast missions against irregular troops the maneuverability and protection should be enough.
Said to say that the Bundeswehr hasn't ordered them yet.

PS: I also saw the PzH2000 in action. ;) :D
We worked together with them during some live fire exercises.The speed of the firing mission is impressive.
 

Killjoy

New Member
Guys the G6-52L that achieved the 76km range is capable of 8 round a minute burst fire but can keep this up for only 80 rounds at full charge, thus 10 minutes due to barrel overheating. After that you run the risk of blowing your self up.

I've seen some very intresting footage of the loader on the G6 at work and have had the privalege of seeing this awesome weapon at work many a time. The shear size of it is amazing.

One thing though don't let any saffer (South African) tell you we did it on our own. We had some help which will cause alot of western countries some pretty red faces if it ever got out. I will give you an hint. Take a look at our TTD (tank technology demonstrator). The hatches have distinct leopard features along with a MTU diesel. I will say no more.
 

rossfrb_1

Member
gf0012-aust said:
Lucky bugger if he has. I've only seen the footage of it "at work" when I was at the 2004 Land Warfare Conf in Oz. Also got to see the corporate doco of the K9 playing in the dirt.

The Sth Koreans were getting a lot of attention from some of the snr army guys.
As an option for Land 17?
How does this translate into ADF 2006 thinking (esp after the recent budget)?
The K9 is a big unit, though not as big as its German or South African equivalents I think.

rb
 

beleg

New Member
K-9 is an impressive unit. On paper it is showing similar capabilities to PzH2000 and in field its performance is superb according to Turkish officers i talked to. Turkey has derived a clone of K-9 with some FCS improvements and some local electronic parts and a modified local turret (known as T-155). Turkey and Korea according to latest news will cooperate on developing an extended range ammo for K-9/T-155. However as stated in the posts above it lacks in deployablility.
 

Big-E

Banned Member
I'm really suprised this conversation hasn't mentioned the FCS NLOS-LS system. I think the ability to put over a dozen munitions on target at over a hundred miles away being carried by a HUMV would revolutionize the artillery game.:eek:
 

Whiskyjack

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Big-E said:
I'm really suprised this conversation hasn't mentioned the FCS NLOS-LS system. I think the ability to put over a dozen munitions on target at over a hundred miles away being carried by a HUMV would revolutionize the artillery game.:eek:
I agree, especially when you consider the ability to minimise civilian casualties. Although Arty will always have its place.

 

Zombie Krupp

New Member
Big-E said:
I'm really suprised this conversation hasn't mentioned the FCS NLOS-LS system. I think the ability to put over a dozen munitions on target at over a hundred miles away being carried by a HUMV would revolutionize the artillery game.:eek:
Not really, that system amounts to a pair of very good anti tank missiles and an interesting launcher concept. It cannot do the job of artillery, which requires volume of fire besides all else; you can’t have volume of fire with missiles because each one will cost at least 30 possibly more then 60,000 dollars. You also don’t have the same responsiveness because it flies much slower then an artillery shell.
The effectiveness against soft and semi hard targets is also going to be inferior. The PAM and LAM are both about the size of Hellfire while having much longer range, so the warhead is unlikely to be over Hellfire’s 20 pounds; similar to the weight of explosives in a 155mm shell. But the 155mm shell gains considerable destructiveness from the metal body fragmenting; you don’t really get fragmentation from the thinly built body of a missile, fragments must be built into that 20-ish pound warhead.

I’m not saying NLOS-LS won’t be great to have and quite effective at what it does, but what it does is not general purpose all weather fire support.
 

Wild Weasel

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We must assume thats what the NLOS-C is being developed for. Whilst the range of the NLOS-C is supposed to be lower than that of some other contemporary systems, it's accuracy and volume of fire are supposed to be on a par with the best arty systems in production.
Additionally, I understand that the sytem's range can be significantly increased simply by utilizing RAP shells.

NLOS-LS is simply a perfect companion to NLOS-C, providing the warfighter with pinpoint accuracy, and long range- and the ability to attack deep into enemy territory, without risk of drawing counter-battery fire.
The NLOS-LS missile system allows for the destruction of hostile artillery before it can be used to destroy somewhat more vulnerable tube, and rocket artillery units.
Once the threat of counter-battery fire is diminished, the slightly shorter range of the NLOS-C becomes less of a tactical deficit- and the advantge of it's extremly high rate of fire begins to pay out major dividends.

Of course, if range, accuracy, and sheer volume of fire are more important than having a lightweight gun battery like NLOS-C in the theater in the shortest amount of time- I can think of no better option than the MLRS family of weapons and launchers. The term, "Steel Rain", and testimony of it's effects from the mouths of the MLRS-strike survivors- speaks volumes.
It's not just terrifying, it's also terrifyingly effective.

That said, I suppose a flight of several dozen UCAVs loaded with GBU-39s might be an even more effective option. :D
 
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Wild Weasel

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Depends on the target of course. I was only providing a general purpose loadout, as a "for instance."
But if you intend to wipe out an entire tank battalion, or a regiment of armored infantry in a single sortie from very long range, without the ability to use ground-based artillery assets- then I'd have to agree that several dozen UCAVs loaded with SFW's, BAT, and/or LOCAAS, would certainly do the trick.
 
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