United States Defense Thread
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John Fedup
The Bunker Group
I wonder what the F/A XX will be designated as?
Todjaeger
Potstirrer
Not necessarily. Remember that the JSF programme had two competing prototypes, Boeing's X-32 vs. LockMart's X-35, which was ultimately selected as the F-35. Given that the 1993 start to the programme also had two other US combat aircraft manufacturers involved, McDonnell Douglas (merged with Boeing in 1997) and Northrop (merged with Grumman to form Northrop Grumman in 1994), it is quite possible each manufacturer had their own numbered design entries. With Boeing entering the X-32 whilst LockMart, competing in the same programme, with the X-35, it would reasonably explain why we had not seen an X-33 or X-34 prototype or even mock up.
As for the jump now to the F-47, it is also quite possible that the US gov't has been running a number of procurement programmes quietly in the background to develop aircraft, with different entries getting number designations even though they did not enter production (or possibly did, but under one or more black programmes)
Terran
Well-Known Member
X33 and X34 were both NASA Programs. The X33 was a Space shuttle replacement that was cancelled the X34 was a precursor to the X37. So they issued X32 to Boeing and X35 to Lockheed Martin then kept the Numeral but changed letter nomenclature.
X47 was a Ucav concept for the Navy. When UAS got into the big time the numbers basically skyrocketed. The known list of X planes is at X69 with a gap to X75 then X76. Now the US military generally is accepted to Skip X69 for reasons of not wanting a briefing to break down into a room of Snickering. It’s likely any flight demonstration aircraft for the NGAD was in the X70 range but carrying over that description would have thrown the numbers off more.
F47 is gimmicky but I think too many go the Trump route and forget the other reason for that number is the P47.
Also the B21 broke the system too with the 21 reference to the 21st century.
MV75 breaks as it’s the 1775 founding of the continental army.
XM1776 isn’t part of the Aviation sequence but the last five vehicles were XM1299 the cancelled 155mm ERCA, XM1300 Heavy Equipment tractor, XM1301 the Infantry Squad Vehicle based off the Chevy Colorado in use with the US Army and Canadian army. XM1302 BAE’s failed MPF assault gun.
Thing is though that the XM1302 competed against the XM10 the cancelled Booker.
XM1776 Mobile Tactical Cannon wheeled might not become the M1776 because the vehicle that’s hosts the XM1776 is the Tatra Force 817, now that’s not a vehicle in the US Army. The Army does have a program looking at replacing it’s current fleet of heavy trucks the HEMET and HETS but last I checked the offerings in that were GM/Rhinementall HX4, Navistar Defense’s ATLAS, Mack Truck’s Granite and Oshkosh with an evolution of the HEMET. That program is on pause anyway. I doubt they would reopen with Tatra.
X (for eXperimental, I think) planes had always, & deliberately, been numbered independently of production types such as A, B, C, F, P etc. The X-29 was a 1980s type, for example, & X-32 & X-35 were in the same sequence.
The likelihood of there being F-36 to F-35, completely secret, at exactly the time as Donald Trump wants an F-47 to honour himself, is unbelievably low. How many years did it take to get from F-15 to F-22? How many secret aircraft were given F- designations in that time? Remember, X designations don't count in the F sequence, any more than P-8, E-7, C-17, B-21 etc. do. They're separate sequences. That's the whole bloody point: the letters & numbers have meanings.
No, the system broke down when an X number was used for an F aircraft, & became farcical with F-47, the Trumpfighter. I hope the number's changed when the reason for it is out of office. Using P-47 is silly, & even suggesting it shows the system's effectively ceased to exist, & designations have become a matter of whim. What next? F-4 again, to celebrate the Phantom? F6F in honour of the Hellcat?
KipPotapych
Well-Known Member
For whatever it’s worth, Google AI’s reply to “is there another reason for the F-47 to be called that other than Trump?”:
The official U.S. Air Force justification for the F-47 designation layers two historical explanations alongside the nod to the 47th president: [1]
It’s way out of depth to debate the subject. But, whoever said, there are coincidences and then there are COINCIDENCES.
Edit: I should have asked the question differently as this is a leading question, to which the “super intelligence” is not immune.
The official U.S. Air Force justification for the F-47 designation layers two historical explanations alongside the nod to the 47th president: [1]
- The P-47 Thunderbolt: It pays homage to the historic Republic P-47 Thunderbolt, a rugged and iconic World War II fighter plane.
- The Air Force Founding Year: It honors 1947, the year the U.S. Air Force officially split from the U.S. Army and became an independent military branch. [1, 2]
It’s way out of depth to debate the subject. But, whoever said, there are coincidences and then there are COINCIDENCES.
Edit: I should have asked the question differently as this is a leading question, to which the “super intelligence” is not immune.
I asked Gemini "why is the f47 called the f47"
It said this
The Boeing F-47 was publicly named by President Donald Trump during an Oval Office announcement on March 21, 2025.
The designation ties together several official and political reasons:
• World War II Legacy: Air Force records and post-announcement justifications connected the "47" to the iconic Republic P-47 Thunderbolt, a heavy-hitting World War II ground-attack and fighter aircraft.
• The 47th President: The number also implicitly honors Donald Trump as the 47th president of the United States, who championed and announced the sixth-generation Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) platform contract.
• Scrambled Military Protocol: Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) releases revealed that Air Force leadership (including Chief of Staff General David Allvin) were initially caught off guard by the designation and quickly scrambled to dig up historical P-47 references to justify the breaking of standard sequential fighter numbering.
So we both asked the questions to the same AI but my question didn't lead it
And got the same answer more or less
The final paragraph in both replies reveals the real reason for trying to find alternate reasons, much like the UK MoD decided that Boris Johnson's T32 slip of the tongue needed a justification and then made a load of stuff up about a non existing program in the hope that Boris would stick around and be too narcissistic to admit his mistake.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
Kegsbreath has fired another top general (top military planner for Pentagon). Spectulation is he wasn't keen on Trump's possible re-start of action against Iran (epic-fury2). If the mid-terms turn out to be a major loss for the GOP, there will likely be a real $hit-storm developing he if actually procedes with epic-fury2.
www.realcleardefense.com
Hegseth Fires the Pentagon’s Top Military Planner As Trump Considers New Iran Strikes - RealClearDefense
WASHINGTON (AP) — Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth has fired the Pentagon’s top military planner, a defense official said Wednesday, the latest in a...
FormerDirtDart
Well-Known Member
The DoD/DoW statement is that Lt. Gen. Brett Sylvia was relieved as he is under investigation for leaking classified information to the press.Kegsbreath has fired another top general (top military planner for Pentagon). Spectulation is he wasn't keen on Trump's possible re-start of action against Iran (epic-fury2). If the mid-terms turn out to be a major loss for the GOP, there will likely be a real $hit-storm developing he if actually procedes with epic-fury2.
Hegseth Fires the Pentagon’s Top Military Planner As Trump Considers New Iran Strikes - RealClearDefense
WASHINGTON (AP) — Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth has fired the Pentagon’s top military planner, a defense official said Wednesday, the latest in a...
SolarisKenzo
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't let Hegseth run a day gym, let alone the Pentagon.
FormerDirtDart
Well-Known Member
An interesting observation from Washington Post reporter Dan Lamothe on tweet/statement from Chief Pentagon Spokesman/SecDef Advisor Sean Parnell
I would note that it has become pretty routine for the current administration label all sorts of normal day-to-day business "sensitive national security information"
I would note that it has become pretty routine for the current administration label all sorts of normal day-to-day business "sensitive national security information"
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
I think most here understand bovine excrement wrt anything concerning the Trump administration.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
…or a bar!
FormerDirtDart
Well-Known Member
Timely context on the current administration's labeling matters as "national security"
OldTex
Well-Known Member
Yet the Secretary can do virtually the same thing (including one or more journalists on a supposedly secure chat) and escape any adverse action