T-90 in Comparison to Western Armour

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extern

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Hmm T-90A is the same as T-90S.
The indian T-90S has no Shtora. The Algerian T-90SA has 'reduced' Shtora without IR lamp. Also there are some differences in FCS and air-conditioning capability between T-90A and the export variants. Differences in armoring are classified.
 

Ares

New Member
T-90S is Russian army Vladimir mbt. Latest version is T-90S Vladimir obrazov 2006 (turret example 2006).
 

extern

New Member
Getting it angled at the 60 degree frontal arc is still the most important for tank to tank encounters.

Thanks - can I gain access to this information on Relikt.:)
The effectiveness of any ERA work against the incoming treats is approximately depended of the hit angle as sinus function from 0 to 1. It's near zero if the treat comes on 0 degree (on normal perpendicular). So they allways try to put the blocks under the proprial angle to the most probably hit direction. The geometry of ERA blocks is different from model to model and depends rather from the turret/hull geometry then from ERA kind.

On the pictures you can compare the layout of the containers of Contact-5 (4S22) on T-72B and cast T90 with the 'Relict' (4S23) kit on T-72B 'Rogatka'. T-90 has inbuilded ERA containers while the last modular standard for ERA hang up will be proliferated for ALL future modernisation due to its better changeableness:
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Far be it from me to tell you that with all the sophistication of the modern tank technology neither the protection nor the weapon mounted on tanks provide 100% performance 100% of the time.

Neither the US nor the Russian latest rounds have been tested in combat so far, and certainly not against the more recent armour packages, so we would be just speculating as to their success or failure. Whatever results achieved during tests can not be taken as proof of performance in combat.

Lets keep in mind that the A2 on the M1 has been largely due to the design of the Svinetz-2 round in Russia in the late 90s, and I expect that it has not been improved on in the last decade.

Cheers
Greg
Quite true - you can have the best overall technology on a MBT but things can and will go wrong, Just have a TI system overheat and just watch a crew freak out because they have to go to a degraded mode for the rest of the battle. Battlefield conditions will also be the determining factor in performance on the battlefield.

We have actually tested K-5 armor tiles for the design and research phase of the M829A3 round, we went with information based on knowledge that Ukraine thinks they have for K-6 Kaktus armor tile package.

You are correct that the armor package for the M1A2 has not been improved since its introduction, but it does have the Russians worried for extended battlefield engagement ranges.
 

extern

New Member
T-90S is Russian army Vladimir mbt. Latest version is T-90S Vladimir obrazov 2006 (turret example 2006).
'Obrazov' - isnt it really? The name 'Vladimir' is in honor of the chief T-90's designer Vladimir Potkin who died suddently at 2002 just before the first T-90S batch went to India.
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
The effectiveness of any ERA work against the incoming treats is approximately depended of the hit angle as sinus function from 0 to 1. It's near zero if the treat comes on 0 degree (on normal perpendicular). So they allways try to put the blocks under the proprial angle to the most probably hit direction. The geometry of ERA blocks is different from model to model and depends rather from the turret/hull geometry then from ERA kind.

On the pictures you can compare the layout of the containers of Contact-5 (4S22) on T-72B and cast T90 with the 'Relict' (4S23) kit on T-72B 'Rogatka'. T-90 has inbuilded ERA containers while the last modular standard for ERA hang up will be proliferated for ALL future modernisation due to its better changeableness:
I agree with you - I should of made it a little more clear in using the 60 degree frontal arc as a example. Most tank designers will design a tank turret with the most armor protection set at the front of the turret, good example would be to go from left and right tank front fenders outer edges and draw lines that will meet at the rear middle part of the tank turret, everything between those lines on the turret should be the best protected.
 

Ares

New Member
Smotrel Udarnaya Sila e voney skazaley schto T-90S VLADIMIR eta T-90A

Watched Udarnaya Sila and they said the T-90S Vladimir is the the T-90A.
 

extern

New Member
I agree with you - I should of made it a little more clear in using the 60 degree frontal arc as a example. Most tank designers will design a tank turret with the most armor protection set at the front of the turret, good example would be to go from left and right tank front fenders outer edges and draw lines that will meet at the rear middle part of the tank turret, everything between those lines on the turret should be the best protected.
We'r speaking about different things. Your question was about the angle between ERA plates and the most probable treat direction. My point is: despite the RPGs/ATGMs mostly come from the front in horizontal direction, ERA plates have to have certain angle with the direction. They can not be put just in vertical position: if so, ERA will not work well against the treat. The plate or counter-explosion must hit the incoming cummulative jet/rod from the side to be effective, like on the following picture about ERA 'Nozh' work:
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
We'r speaking about different things. Your question was about the angle between ERA plates and the most probable treat direction. My point is: despite the RPGs/ATGMs mostly come from the front in horizontal direction, ERA plates have to have certain angle with the direction. They can not be put just in vertical position: if so, ERA will not work well against the treat. The plate or counter-explosion must hit the incoming cummulative jet/rod from the side to be effective, like on the following picture about ERA 'Nozh' work:
Correct - that is where I should of been more specific.
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Anyway it's unofficial name Vladimir.
T-90 S is for export and T-90 A is Russian version, could it be that Russia is holding something a little back from the export model in regards to armor protection levels.:D
 

Chrom

New Member
T-90 S is for export and T-90 A is Russian version, could it be that Russia is holding something a little back from the export model in regards to armor protection levels.:D
I'm pretty sure T-90A and T-90S have same armor composition. Of course, "protection" is still a little different thing as its includes ERA, APS, special paint, etc.
 

FutureTank

Banned Member
T-90 S is for export and T-90 A is Russian version, could it be that Russia is holding something a little back from the export model in regards to armor protection levels.:D
No, it is extremely difficult to change armour configuration on short run production lines. I suspect this is the reason Indians will do their own production for 1000 or so units.

The Russian Army has T-90C also, and this is where the confusion comes from. The original T-90C was developed for the Iranians, but that never went through, and the production went to the Russian Army instead, and as demonstrators for Indians.

Cheers
Greg
 

FutureTank

Banned Member
I'm pretty sure T-90A and T-90S have same armor composition. Of course, "protection" is still a little different thing as its includes ERA, APS, special paint, etc.
Yes, to keep troops busy the tanks are repained daily to look nice and clean. The accumulated paint is now some 12cm in thickness, and consititutes that little bit extra 'armour' :D :) :eek:nfloorl:
 

Chrom

New Member
Yes, to keep troops busy the tanks are repained daily to look nice and clean. The accumulated paint is now some 12cm in thickness, and consititutes that little bit extra 'armour' :D :) :eek:nfloorl:
Special paint can reduce radar, laser and thermal signature.
 
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