Someone have recent Cavour pics ?

[contedicavour]

Yesterday the "Andrea Doria" destroyer start engine for the firts time

I've already seen it run on its engines in August just outside Muggiano. May be this time it's a longer deployment farther away then La Spezia Gulf ! Where did you find the information ?

ciao

 

[Mangusta CBT]

I've already seen it run on its engines in August just outside Muggiano. May be this time it's a longer deployment farther away then La Spezia Gulf ! Where did you find the information ?

ciao

News in Italian from Dedalonews

"Oggi il nuovo cacciatorpedinere Andrea Doria ha dato il suo primo "giro di eliche" in mare. La nave ha infatti lasciato il bacino dei cantieri Fincantieri del Muggiano per effettuare, nelle acque del Golfo di Spezia, la sua prima uscita in mare "motu proprio", ovvero utilizzando per la prima volta l’impianto propulsivo senza il supporto di rimorchiatori.
La nuova imponente sagoma del cacciatorpedinere (dell’evento non sono disponibili al momento immagini) è stata vista ad oltre 15 miglia al largo destando ovviamente la meraviglia dei naviganti, militari e non, che hanno avuto la ventura di incontrare la nave in mare.
Il taglio della prima lamiera di Nave Andrea Doria era aqvvenuto il 19 luglio del 2002 presso il cantiere di Riva Trigoso, lo stesso dove la nave è stata varata il 14 ottobre del 2005; l’unità dovrebbe essere consegnata alla Marina Militare nella metà del 2007, mentre la gemella - il Caio Duilio - nell’inizio del 2009.
Ricordiamo che il Doria è una delle due unità navali sviluppate nell’ambito del programma italo-francese Orizzonte, che nella sua fase iniziale vedeva la presenza anche della Royal Navy inglese, che poi si è sfilata dal programma realizzando con la BAE Systems i caccia Type 45.
Con queste due unità navali la Marina Militare sostituirà i due caccia Audace ed Ardito che quest’anno ha ritirato dal servizio. In attesa dell’entrata in linea dei due nuovi caccia classe Doria, sono in servizio solo i due caccia classe Ammiragli (Durand De la Penne e Mimbelli) che a breve - fondi permettendo - saranno sottoposti presso l’arsenale di Taranto ad estesi lavori di ammodernamento di mezza vita.
Grande attività dei cantieri Fincantieri del Muggiano, dunque, dove è in allestimento anche la nuova portaerei Cavour che, secondo il contratto stipulato con la Marina Militare, dovrebbe entrare in acqua entro il prossimo mese di dicembre, anche se questa scadenza potrebbe essere persino anticipata grazie all’efficienza dell’azienda cantieristica italiana.
Come detto, il programma Orizzonte era iniziato nel 1993 in collaborazione tra Italia, Francia e Inghilterra. Nel 1994 le tre Nazioni hanno sottoscritto il MoU che prevedeva una fase iniziale di studio di fattibilità ed una seconda fase di sviluppo e costruzione delle prime navi AAW, una per ciascuna nazione.
Nell’aprile 1999, a seguito della decisione inglese di abbandonare il programma, l’Italia e la Francia hanno esaminato la possibilità di continuare la collaborazione e, nel settembre 1999, hanno deciso di proseguire congiuntamente nel progetto Orizzonte.
La firma del contratto di sviluppo e costruzione di quattro caccia antiaerei italo-francesi Orizzonte è stata annunciata a Parigi, in occasione del salone degli armamenti navali EURONAVAL, nell’ottobre del 2000.
All’epoca il costo totale del programma è stato stimato in circa 2.800 milioni di euro per le quattro navi, due per l’Italia e due per la Francia. La costruzione dei due caccia Orizzonte italiani interessa i cantieri navali Fincantieri di Riva Trigoso e del Muggiano, presso quest’ultimo sarà realizzato l’allestimento delle due piattaforme. (Le immagini sono del sito della Marina Militare e si riferiscono al varo e alle uscite in mare del Doria della darsena del Muggiano con l’ausilio dei rimorchiatori).

 

[contedicavour]

Thanks for the article ! Hopefully we'll find more articles on the defence ministry press review (www.difesa.it - rassegna stampa).

There are a few minor mistakes though in the article
> Audace and Ardito are in reserve since 2005 (in the La Spezia arsenal on the westernmost pier)
> technically Doria has been "in the water" for quite a while already, and the same is valid for the Cavour since it came out of the huge 20,000 ton dock which is normally stationed in Muggiano in front of the personnel parking lot.
> Doria was sailing with auxiliary electrical engines in the Muggiano area (it changed berths/piers several times in the last months), but the article clarifies that it's the first time the ship goes really out to sea on its main engines LM2500 GE/Fiat Avio.

Anyway let's continue to exchange articles as they come out and thank you

cheers

 

[Big-E]

If your going to post an article in another language, run it through Google language tools to english pleazzzzz.

 

[contedicavour]

If your going to post an article in another language, run it through Google language tools to english pleazzzzz.

The article is describing the sea trials of the Andrea Doria, 1st operational Horizon class DDG. Though still no Aster-30 launches for the moment. The article also says that the carrier Cavour is to run sea trials very soon versus an initially expected deadline of early Dec 2006 (actually Fincantieri shipyard had already announced they are 3 months ahead of schedule).

cheers

 

[contedicavour]

Does anybody have access to Google Earth pictures of La Spezia taken after June 2006 ?
I was looking on Google Earth and I can't find any, though I have the free access and may be paying members have access to updates ?
I'm of course looking of pics of the Muggiano shipyard with the Cavour carrier inside...

cheers

 

[Mangusta CBT]

...

On Internet i have find many various rendering of FREMM frigates, do you know the true one ?

 

[contedicavour]

On Internet i have find many various rendering of FREMM frigates, do you know the true one ?

Well, first of all the size is slowly increasing : Fincantieri communicated mid May that the ships will be 6,000 tons, 140 meters long, 145 crew, autonomy 6000 nautical miles at 15 knots, CODLAG propulsion including 4 diesels and 2 reversible electrical engines for 27 knots max speed.

The latest rendering for the Italian GP version is this one (issued in June by Fincantieri)

 

[Mangusta CBT]

You are a sink of info

Some other question:

Do you know the state of the Vulcano ammo program ? Vulcano will be a force points of the GP FREMM.

Do you know the type of the seeker of the ASW version of the Vulcano ammo ?

From Oto Melara

"The ammunition configuration includes:

* unguided multipurpose extended range ammo capable of reaching 70 Km
* terminal guided ammo with on board seeker for long range precise Asw up to 70 Km
* guided ammo with inertial guidance system and GPS for precise long range shore bombardment up to 100 km "

 

[contedicavour]

You are a sink of info

Some other question:

Do you know the state of the Vulcano ammo program ? Vulcano will be a force points of the GP FREMM.

Do you know the type of the seeker of the ASW version of the Vulcano ammo ?

From Oto Melara

"The ammunition configuration includes:

* unguided multipurpose extended range ammo capable of reaching 70 Km
* terminal guided ammo with on board seeker for long range precise Asw up to 70 Km
* guided ammo with inertial guidance system and GPS for precise long range shore bombardment up to 100 km "

Vulcano programme advances, since it was luckily spared from budget cuts in the last 2 years.
Actually the English translation of Oto Melara is a bit misleading, since the munition is anti-surface or ASUW, not ASW (anti-submarine).
If the target is an enemy vessel (for example a very fast 50-knot armed craft) then the munition receives by radio trajectory correction from the ship's fire-control radars. The small fin wings on the 127mm or 76mm ammunition allow for some significant trajectory modifications.
If the target is for example a MBT sitting on the shore, then GPS is indispensable to correct trajectory.

cheers

 

[Mangusta CBT]

Vulcano programme advances, since it was luckily spared from budget cuts in the last 2 years.
Actually the English translation of Oto Melara is a bit misleading, since the munition is anti-surface or ASUW, not ASW (anti-submarine).
If the target is an enemy vessel (for example a very fast 50-knot armed craft) then the munition receives by radio trajectory correction from the ship's fire-control radars. The small fin wings on the 127mm or 76mm ammunition allow for some significant trajectory modifications.
If the target is for example a MBT sitting on the shore, then GPS is indispensable to correct trajectory.

cheers

Therefore the guidance of the ASuW version is "beam reading" like Davide ?

 

[contedicavour]

Therefore the guidance of the ASuW version is "beam reading" like Davide ?

Yep absolutely. By the way, last month's edition of RID (rivista italiana difesa) carries a long article on the history of all CIWS systems in Italian naval service, including the latest davide/strales family of ammunition.

cheers

 

[Mangusta CBT]

Star sea trial of Cavour ?? :

 

[contedicavour]

Star sea trial of Cavour ?? :

Unofficial answer : Fincantieri is fed up with delays in budget funding by the cash-strapped defence ministry and is thus slowing down a bit work on Cavour and Duilio by using less personnel (to be clear, "cassa integrazione" is not far )

Official answer : superstructure work finished, electronics testing underway, engine testing with start of sea trials imminent.

You won't see much more than brief movements around Muggiano for the moment though, since 1+ days' deployments will not occur before Nov-Dec.

cheers

 

[Mangusta CBT]

It seems me that the payments for Cavour in this last year they have been regular, i don't hear budget cut in Cavour

 

[contedicavour]

It seems me that the payments for Cavour in this last year they have been regular, i don't hear budget cut in Cavour

The budget's there allright, it's on payment terms that the government is playing (by extending delays and forcing suppliers to take up the negative cash impact).
Don't worry the ship will be sailing allright before Christmas...

ciao

 

[Mangusta CBT]

I have read that the guidance system of DART and Vulcano ASuW is very versatile and scalable. Will be possible create a 120 mm guided antitank shell with this guidance ? i think this shell will be also "anti aircraft" capability.

 

[contedicavour]

I have read that the guidance system of DART and Vulcano ASuW is very versatile and scalable. Will be possible create a 120 mm guided antitank shell with this guidance ? i think this shell will be also "anti aircraft" capability.

I have read that Vulcano will be adapted to suit the Army's needs on 120mm and potentially 155mm guns. However it is Oto Melara's initiative, since the Army isn't funding this exploratory work on extending the work on 76mm and 127mm.

ciao

 

[Dandolo]

@Contedicavour

Considering the budget law 2007 (which enhances the defence fund for new investments) do you think it is possible to start building the FREMM fregates and other 2 U212 for MMI already during the first semester 2007?
Thanks

any other new from Fincantieri?

 

[contedicavour]

@Contedicavour

Considering the budget law 2007 (which enhances the defence fund for new investments) do you think it is possible to start building the FREMM fregates and other 2 U212 for MMI already during the first semester 2007?
Thanks

any other new from Fincantieri?

Salve, it's always a pleasure to see Italians join this forum
The first 2 Bergamini (FREMM) are fully funded by an off-budget mortgage (actually Industry Ministry R&D funds) and will start building next summer in Riva Trigoso.
The new budget law, if it actually passes Parliament without changes, fixes 1.7bn euro investment for international procurement plans for 2007 and a total of 4.4bn until 2009. However what isn't clear is whether this is incremental to 2006 investment allowance or not. The Navy's n°1 priority, since FREMM is already funded (at least, the first 2), is 2 extra U-212A, so with some luck we may see the contract confirmed (currently the navy has an option). Let's all hope it works

ciao