S. Arabia to buy French aircraft (Rafale)!!!

[P.A.F]

http://www.dawn.com/2005/04/16/int11.htm

S. Arabia to buy French aircraft

By Our Correspondent
RIYADH, April 15: Saudi Arabia has signed a memorandum of understanding with France to buy 48 Rafale aircraft from Dassault Aviation with an option for a further 48, French business daily Les Echos reported on Friday.

The deal for the multi-role fighters, estimated to be worth up to six billion euros ($7.72 billion), could be finalized by the end of the year, the newspaper said. If the deal gets through, it could have implications for British Aerospace, which has a running contract with the Saudi defence forces.

Although no official confirmation of the MoU was available, it was reportedly reached during a two-day visit to France by the Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah bin Abdul-Aziz. Combat and corporate aircraft maker Dassault Aviation could not immediately be reached for comment. The Elysee presidential palace would not comment.

Quoting Jean-Francois Bureau, the spokesman for France's defence ministry, news agency Reuters quoted him as saying: "It's a discussion process that started a long time ago. I do not have the impression that we are in a final phase and if it was the case it would be up to the Saudi authorities to announce it."
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Hope they go for it because it will sure beef-up there defences

 

[P.A.F]

another source
http://news.ft.com/cms/s/1bffffc4-ad4c-11d9-ad92-00000e2511c8.html
Saudis pledge to buy French jets in €6bn deal
By Jean-Pierre Neu in Paris
Published: April 15 2005 03:00 | Last updated: April 15 2005 03:00

Saudi Arabia has agreed in principle to acquire up to 96 Rafale combat aircraft from France's Dassault Aviation for some €6bn, Les Echos, the FT's French sister newspaper, has learnt.

The agreement forms the cornerstone of a broader defence, security and industrial accord estimated to be worth up to €20bn ($26bn, £14bn) signed during a meeting in Paris yesterday between Jacques Chirac, French president, and Crown Prince Abdullah, Saudi Arabia's de facto ruler.

 

[adsH]

another source
http://news.ft.com/cms/s/1bffffc4-ad4c-11d9-ad92-00000e2511c8.html
Saudis pledge to buy French jets in €6bn deal
By Jean-Pierre Neu in Paris
Published: April 15 2005 03:00 | Last updated: April 15 2005 03:00

Saudi Arabia has agreed in principle to acquire up to 96 Rafale combat aircraft from France's Dassault Aviation for some €6bn, Les Echos, the FT's French sister newspaper, has learnt.

The agreement forms the cornerstone of a broader defence, security and industrial accord estimated to be worth up to €20bn ($26bn, £14bn) signed during a meeting in Paris yesterday between Jacques Chirac, French president, and Crown Prince Abdullah, Saudi Arabia's de facto ruler.

Didn't i say this would of happened sooner or later!! People here were rejecting the assertion.

 

[P.A.F]

Quote:
Originally Posted by P.A.F
another source
http://news.ft.com/cms/s/1bffffc4-a...000e2511c8.html
Saudis pledge to buy French jets in €6bn deal
By Jean-Pierre Neu in Paris
Published: April 15 2005 03:00 | Last updated: April 15 2005 03:00
http://news.ft.com/c.gif
Saudi Arabia has agreed in principle to acquire up to 96 Rafale combat aircraft from France's Dassault Aviation for some €6bn, Les Echos, the FT's French sister newspaper, has learnt.

The agreement forms the cornerstone of a broader defence, security and industrial accord estimated to be worth up to €20bn ($26bn, £14bn) signed during a meeting in Paris yesterday between Jacques Chirac, French president, and Crown Prince Abdullah, Saudi Arabia's de facto ruler.



Didn't i say this would of happened sooner or later!! People here were rejecting the assertion.

Sorry

 

[webmaster]

This report was rejected by French MoD and no confirmation from Dassault or saudis. This was in the news reported by AFP day after this news came out initially.

 

[mysterious]

Well I'm still hoping its true cuz if it is, it could have implications (directly or indirectly) for PAF's much awaited acquisition of a frontline fighter. And of course, adsh gets 10/10 for his foresight if this comes around.

 

[kashifshahzad]

Why does S.A wants to spend a huge amount on its air defence only cant thay buy the thunders or something like that i think Pakistan does not have that kinda amount to buy these kinds of expensive planes my sujjestion is this spend a little on large no of planes more suitable to your pilots and your region this wil be help full i think India is not in a condition to buy this much amount of planes on these rates

_______________________
I simply reject these purchases i sujjest that try to concentrate on tech transfer but how are they gonna do this caz they have the oil fields sit and eat

 

[adsH]

Well I'm still hoping its true cuz if it is, it could have implications (directly or indirectly) for PAF's much awaited acquisition of a frontline fighter. And of course, adsh gets 10/10 for his foresight if this comes around.

i think it as in 2000 when the defense regime there in Saudi Announced they needed a new jet (first choice was the Rafael). since then its been really quiet. and GF did say the Saudi's rejected the Rafael, i believe he was right they may of had a change of heart. they change there decisions often. i'm sure the EF-2000 was the second runner up. but since Abdullah is in-Charge the British aeroSpace would have problems selling anything to them. And Abdullah is closer to the Pakistanis he would bring the Saudi Defense inline with the Pakistani forces (for future interoperability). And plus it seems like the Saudi decision Committee may have had received some serious kickback for this deal. But i doubt that was the reason i mean to justify the move from an existing supplier such as BAE systems you need a Political reason.

 

[adsH]

One more thing, if i was working for the Uk gov in promoting the Euro Fighter. i would Sincerely Get the Ambassador in Riyadh to Meet with the Higher Archy, work out the reasons why they chose an inferior Platform over the EF while they have an existing working relationship with us. we've been nothing but an exceptionally good supplier to them. I don't understand why they would choose to go french on arses. I would reassure the Saudi Gov that we can provide there industry involvement in the program unless the french in there desperation have offered joint production. i bet this has something to do with the royal Saudi Investor who owns large scale shares in the Dasult Aviation. I would get our Foreign secretary down there to personally, to get the Saudi's to change there Mind. this is just a MOU. I would reassure the Saudi's that there local industry would be allowed to participate in the consortium, and offer them a token contribution. since this is the theme they are working onn.
I would also use countries that have an increased influence ove them to pressure them into buying our stuff, the two nations that have leverage over them are the Americans and the Pakistani's. Both need to be brought on our side, on this one. but seems like we've alienated the Pakistani's (Thank-you Foreign secretary Jack straw) then we should use the Americans. Even tho the Abdullah Admin will not bow to the american pressure then we should approach the whole thing indirectly through the Pro american part of the royal family the 2nd to Crown prince Sultan who is also the defense minister.

 

[tatra]

These Rafales, will they be added to current inventory of aircraft (Hawk 65, F5B/E/F, F15C/D/S, Tornado ADS/IDV) or will they replace some of the current inventory (and if so, which aircraft will they replace)?

 

[adsH]

These Rafales, will they be added to current inventory of aircraft (Hawk 65, F5B/E/F, F15C/D/S, Tornado ADS/IDV) or will they replace some of the current inventory (and if so, which aircraft will they replace)?

F-5 and the older tornado Possibly but the initial intent was the F-5. again seems like diversification or could be a Trading tactic, it doesn't make sense why they would go towards the French when there is a large scale Bae Footprint in the country.

 

[rajupaki]

Oh give those Rafales to us(pakistan), we will garuntee their safety man! . They could easily buy 400-500 JF17's in that money along with weapons. Who says that we are the poorest among the world(may be Mushy use to say it in his speeches) .

 

[SABRE]

KSA has not yet decided on any AirCraft. This is just a roumer. They have Rafales, EF-2000, F-15E/F for AirSuperiority & F-16s, Mirage2000-9 & JAS-39 Gripens for MultiRoles.

A Pakistani F-15 pilot (designated & owned by KSA AF) & a local Prince (also a pilot of KSA F-15) are said to evaluate between Rafales & Ef-2000 togather. I was told that they are being trained on simuliaters & will also fly the actual aircraft aswell. Purchase will come only after their evaluation. Since there is no report of them flying either AC, it would be a lie to say that KSA AF has choosen Rafales.

If KSA goes for Rafales than I think they would buy Mirage2000-9 as multirole ACs but I do believe that F-16s may already have won the evaluation process secretly. Rest is just formality.

YES if KSA-AF buys Rafales than it is an indication that PAF may also have finalized the Rafales or may finalize Rafales as their front line AirCrafts.

 

[SABRE]

Also take in notice that PAF officials are more in favor of UAE-AF type of formation than KSA-AF. Which signifies that PAF may choose Mirage2000-9 over Rafales, since Mirage2000-9 shares some capabilities with Rafales.

 

[adsH]

if thats the case we may get to see the EF-2000 in Saudi Arabia. the EF2000 would definitely win. I'm so confident that i could bet on it. the trench 2 Capability 2 version should have a prototype those could be used for the evaluations. But the evaluations would be on a Training Base (i can't remember the name, its in this month AFM Issue, detailed article about EF-2000). Britain and germany are the only ones that have Training facility for this type so far. I think its more about handling characteristics at this point and the rest would be Paper Based Evaluations. regardless of the-type of evaluations the EF-2000 would kill the rafael of the list. Our EW packages would definitely be Way better then the French.

 

[SABRE]

yeah I too believe that EF-2000 may get the victory signal. It all depends upon the two pilots, specialy the Prince since he has direct access to Prince Sultan the Chief of KSA Armed Forces. If French offer a better deal & impress the Prince (like in UAE condition...Dessault impressed Abu Dhabi's prince who is also a pilot on F-16).
But I think EF-2000 may just get the victory & along with that the F-16s.

On the other hand considering the Arab-Israel conflict, France is the only country offering risk free deal. That might just give away victory to Dessault & KSA might buy Rafale & Mirage2000-9. UAE had same concerns but they decided to opperate both US & French ACs.

 

[adsH]

yeah I too believe that EF-2000 may get the victory signal. It all depends upon the two pilots, specialy the Prince since he has direct access to Prince Sultan the Chief of KSA Armed Forces. If French offer a better deal & impress the Prince (like in UAE condition...Dessault impressed Abu Dhabi's prince who is also a pilot on F-16).
But I think EF-2000 may just get the victory & along with that the F-16s.

On the other hand considering the Arab-Israel conflict, France is the only country offering risk free deal. That might just give away victory to Dessault & KSA might buy Rafale & Mirage2000-9. UAE had same concerns but they decided to opperate both US & French ACs.

You know when this News came out first i said to my self Prince Sultan Voted for Rafael, Can never happen. Prince Sultan would push for anything that is british or American. I actually thought that Abdullah Intervened, and opted for French (Very Unlikely) these brothers don't fight over things like these they each have areas of responsibilities aided with the best experts money can buy.
Incase of an Israel-Arab War,saudis will never fight. they lack the capability. And the political will for a fight. Besides UK will never Block supplies for the Tornadoes even if there was an Israel-kSA war, can't say the same about French or the US. the french with there Rules would block supplies to prevent escalation the US would do it to Back Israel, but the UK wouldn't Care.

 

[kashifshahzad]

Oh give those Rafales to us(pakistan), we will garuntee their safety man! . They could easily buy 400-500 JF17's in that money along with weapons. Who says that we are the poorest among the world(may be Mushy use to say it in his speeches) .

Lol what will they do when they get our stupid JF-17 thunder interpretors they already have latest aircrafts.They sell oil and buy technology and spend much on defence

 

[SABRE]

You know when this News came out first i said to my self Prince Sultan Voted for Rafael, Can never happen. Prince Sultan would push for anything that is british or American. I actually thought that Abdullah Intervened, and opted for French (Very Unlikely) these brothers don't fight over things like these they each have areas of responsibilities aided with the best experts money can buy.
Incase of an Israel-Arab War,saudis will never fight. they lack the capability. And the political will for a fight. Besides UK will never Block supplies for the Tornadoes even if there was an Israel-kSA war, can't say the same about French or the US. the french with there Rules would block supplies to prevent escalation the US would do it to Back Israel, but the UK wouldn't Care.

Saudis wont fight but there still is a paranoia that Israel may attack KSA & there are holly sites to be protected. They need stronger AirDefence & offence compared to Israel. If Britain is willing to offer risk free AC & its weapons than KSA would be interested but since EF-2000 carries some of the American equipment (which can be subject to ban on export specialy to KSA during Arab-Israel war if it takes place) Prince Abdulah would be least interested.

Prince Sultan is the chief of Armed forces & Prince Abdulah is the crown prince with the powers of the king, since King Fahad is like a pilow on the bed now days. Sultan is moderate, he doesnt care who sells hom what as long as it is latest technology. Abdulah knows the politics & tries things which are risk free. He doesnt like Americans, Israelis, Brits, Indians & Russians (he has said this him self) He also dislikes Egyption & Palistenian past & present authorities (He once ordered evacuation of all egyptions from KSA in 24hrs). Since finance is in Abdulah's hands Sultan will have hard time convincing him over Typhoons. Besides the Prince who is to test Rafale & EF-2000 is also anti-American & Britain. He is directly related to Abdulah (His younger blood brother's son...brother from same mother). So there are various hurdles in front of Ef-2000 & almost non infront of Rafales but the Pakistani pilot who is also to test them is in favor of EF-2000. So it all comes down to when the two pilots test the both ACs.

 

[adsH]

Prince Sultan is the chief of Armed forces & Prince Abdulah is the crown prince with the powers of the king, since King Fahad is like a pilow on the bed now days.

Malik Fahad is Still Alive and he still is the King he's in good health by the way no pillows or beds. My family has worked closely to the royal family in the Past i can tell you one thing. Fahad has an amazing stamina. and All the brothers (Top Line) are Pro American.