Russian Air Force News & Discussion

[Sandhi Yudha]

Depends on what you compare it to. The Europeans are still using Tornados, and the Su-24 is still more numerous then the Su-34 (this will change over the next year). But the Su-34 is also a carrier for some fairly sophisticated EW, and a whole range of recon and EW pods are being designed for it, to decrease reliance on dedicated EW and recon platforms, which are in short supply. The Su-34 will become a very important aircraft for the VVS over the coming decade. Probably more important then the Su-35S.

Agree, I think the Su-27IB/-34 isn't outdated at all, many modern fighterjets were supposed to fly/enter service in the nineties like the Rafale, Eurofighter 2000 and JAS-39 Gripen.
There are not many aircrafts with the capabilities of the Su-34...

 

[Haavarla]

Agree, I think the Su-27IB/-34 isn't outdated at all, many modern fighterjets were supposed to fly/enter service in the nineties like the Rafale, Eurofighter 2000 and JAS-39 Gripen.
There are not many aircrafts with the capabilities of the Su-34...

I would argue that the difference regarding Su-34, its a different class. It even stand out from the Su-30 linage and F-15E. Yes there are some overlaping capabilities. But the way they designed the Su-34, Tactical bomber with lots of options. Growler like, support Radar pod system and ability to carry some pretty large sticks.

But as no one else have bothered fielding new Fighter bombers, it does not make the Su-34 any more modern. It still carry all load external.
Its more in the modernizing roadmap of systems.

 

[Tsavo Lion]

Agreed, & they don't terribly need to obtain a copy of SU-34,

Rather, the new aircraft—while it is clearly a Su-27 derivative—appears to be a parallel development inspired by the Fullback. It is possible that the Chinese modified the Su-27 independently based on what they knew about the Su-34. But it is also possible that the Chinese either gleaned the technology through espionage or via a third party.

If some SU-34s exported to Algeria, or any other friendly nation, the PRC could ask for, & get access to it.

 

[Haavarla]

Agreed, & they don't terribly need to obtain a copy of SU-34,
If some SU-34s exported to Algeria, or any other friendly nation, the PRC could ask for, & get access to it.

Algeries have signed for 24 more Su-30ME. An impoved Su-30MKA.
well China could ask, but why would Algerie give them anything?

 

[Tsavo Lion]

I don't speak for them, but they got 3 naval ships from PRC already, so why not? If not sold, at least providing access to an airframe & documentation may be enough to verify/compare/confirm certain aspects of design.

 

[Feanor]

I don't speak for them, but they got 3 naval ships from PRC already, so why not? If not sold, at least providing access to an airframe & documentation may be enough to verify/compare/confirm certain aspects of design.

Algeria has been buying buckets of Russian gear. If they started sharing it with third parties, they would have a problem with getting more.

 

[Haavarla]

Some updates:

"Ð*уÑÑкие ВитÑзи" полноÑтью укомплектовали группу новыми Ñамолетами Су-30СМ - bmpd

Russian Knights have 8 Su-30SM now.

Ð’ 2016 году МиниÑтерÑтво обороны Ð*оÑÑии получило пÑÑ‚ÑŒ полковых комплектов ЗÐ*С С-400 - bmpd

Some comments from BMPD re. SAMs.
Claims total S-400 compliment is 16 polks. I guess they are assuming the latest 5 polks are 2 brigades..?
A pre-serial S-400 polk was also delivered in 2007-2009.
Currently Buk-M2 is being delivered under a 2013 contract (1 unit received Buk-M2 prior). 1 brigade (3 divisions each) was delivered in 2015 and 2016.
In addition, we have the first Buk-M3 brigade (two divisional).

https://twitter.com/RSS_40

The new AA facilities near St. Petersburg are online, so production capacity has expanded.
Not by coincidence 2017 was mentioned as the first year when the system could be exported.

 

[Tsavo Lion]

Su-34s flew into the stratosphere Translation: Modern bombers Su-34 flew in the stratosphere at supersonic speed. The pilots also worked on the exercise of air navigation, landing and take-off at night and flew on a given route. The exercises were held in the Khabarovsk Territory. Head of the press service of VVS Colonel Alexander Gordeyev noted that as the final exercise pilots worked for bombing ground targets imaginary enemy. According to Tass, the maneuvers were carried out in the framework of the final test for the 2016 academic year. Air Force pilots bomber regiment of the Eastern Military District took part in the event.
What is their design max altitude? Going that high is unusual for a ground attack plane, but this 1 benefits from it's Su-27 direct ancestor.

 

[Haavarla]

That depends on their weapons on each mission i think.
But in Syria, they have carried KAB-250/500 for the most part, and only stayed above the MANPAD's reach.
Imo, not that high altitude at all.

The Su-34 is neighter the dash high speed or a particular high flyer.
The Su-27 has a better performance for these things.

The Su-34 best performance is in the mission range or "long legs", with ability to carry fairly large and heavy weapons if need be.
That is why the Su-34 is called a Frontline tactical bomber.

 

[Tsavo Lion]

The stratosphere is where MiG-25 interceptors (with service ceiling of at least 22,500m & up to record 37,650m (123,524 ft)) were like fish in the water:

at mid latitudes, it starts at 10–13 km (33,000–43,000 ft; 6.2–8.1 mi) and ends at 50 km (160,000 ft; 31 mi)..

Could they be considering the Su-34s for that role as a stop-gap until MiG-31 follow on appears, or getting them ready to carry new missiles to be launched from there like planned modernized Tu-160, or both?

 

[Toblerone]

The su-34 is a Flanker two-seater derivative with side-by-side seats optimised as a tactical bomber. How would this be a stopgap mig-31 replacement, its performance isn't even close.

(Maybe in the future they will bring out an improved su-35 with upgraded engines that can supercruise, that could be a stopgap maybe?)

The high-flying su-34 test could be for some cruise missile deployment, the higher and faster you are, the more range the missile has, right?

 

[Tsavo Lion]

I thought the same on all points, but is supercruise need on the BVR interceptor? The Su-30 could be adopted also, but the Su-34 can carry heavier i.e. longer range AA missiles.

 

[Feanor]

Guys this entire conversation is divorced from reality. The MiG-31 is not going anywhere. They're upgrading the existing fleet, and looking at re-equipping it with new missiles (I'm hoping they go for the R-77).

The Su-34 while designated "tactical bomber" in Russian press is actually a strike fighter. It has been seen carrying both the R-73 and R-27. It should, in principle, be able to carry the R-77 as well.

 

[Toblerone]

Feanor you are right, the mig-31 cannot be replaced by any existing platform. And you are right about the su-34 being a strike fighter, I thought of it later when away from the PC.

But there is an expiration date on the mig-31, the airframes are old and production will not resume. A mig-41 seems like a pipe dream to me ... I doubt they will be able to create a proper replacement any time soon.
https://sputniknews.com/military/20...rt-Developing-Replacement-for-MiG-31-in-2017/


Also, about the su-35, it carried the longer range r-77 variant in Syria
https://www.reddit.com/r/syriancivi...35s_in_syria_with_new_airtoair_r771_missiles/

 

[Feanor]

Feanor you are right, the mig-31 cannot be replaced by any existing platform. And you are right about the su-34 being a strike fighter, I thought of it later when away from the PC.

But there is an expiration date on the mig-31, the airframes are old and production will not resume. A mig-41 seems like a pipe dream to me ... I doubt they will be able to create a proper replacement any time soon.
https://sputniknews.com/military/20...rt-Developing-Replacement-for-MiG-31-in-2017/


Also, about the su-35, it carried the longer range r-77 variant in Syria
https://www.reddit.com/r/syriancivi...35s_in_syria_with_new_airtoair_r771_missiles/

It depends on what you mean by soon. Russia is definitely working on a hypersonic interceptor. The current MiG-31 upgrades will probably see the type operating through 2030. For a program that started in the middle of this decade reaching flight testing by the end of the next decade is not inconceivable. That having been said there's just too little information at this time. For the time being there is no replacement, and the MiG-31 fleet will be it.

 

[Haavarla]

The Sokol plant has turned around some 90-100 upgrades Mig-31BM.
The final figure is around 120.

They have started reproduced some Mig-31 parts, like its cockpit glass etc. The cockpit glass has had severly restrictions in the Mig-31 high speed performance for many years now.

They have also overhauled the RD-30-D6 engines with some new parts for increased performance(unknown to me).

The Mig-31 is a low G performance jet, thus it should have plenty of years life hours left.
And the Mig-31 does not supercruise if we are to use the correct term.
It does go supersonic allright, but that is something totaly different vs supercruise.

I believe the Su-35s can supercruise with 4-6 AAM at optimal altitude.
Anyway I still question the advertised usefullness of supercruise.. it will greatly reduce your mission range.

 

[Tsavo Lion]

What about reports of problems with new/upgraded engines for them? 1 crashed just a year ago in Siberia.

 

[Haavarla]

What about reports of problems with new/upgraded engines for them? 1 crashed just a year ago in Siberia.

Pls be carefull quote anything from Janes these days.
In my world they are only re quoting any other bad news outlet, thus are no better.

That incident was one year ago, and they do or did have at one point allmost 300 Mig-31 in service.
They lost a few, yes. Bur that the is hardly any evidence to use eigther way. If you really think that such is relevant, the Mig-31 does fare better vs most other jets anyway.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

From which i understand the first flight of the Il-112 will be in the summer of 2017, but how about the development of the Technoavia Rysachok? No much recent information about this project available on the internet...

 

[Feanor]

From which i understand the first flight of the Il-112 will be in the summer of 2017, but how about the development of the Technoavia Rysachok? No much recent information about this project available on the internet...

It's another abortive An-2 replacement. It remains to be seen whether it goes anywhere. For now SibNIA is putting out modified An-2s from Soviet stock.

ÐœÐ¾Ð´ÐµÑ€Ð½Ð¸Ð·Ð°Ñ†Ð¸Ñ Ñамолета Ðн-2

It's a purely commercial project and I forget how many they've done already but it's a few. They're also working on further development of that project that involves a monoplane instead of the biplane but still using used An-2s as the basis.

http://www.ato.ru/content/v-2015-godu-sibnia-podnimet-v-vozduh-kompozicionnyy-biplan

Finally they also have a reworked biplane variant under the same name.

http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1337005.html

SibNIA is currently working on a future light plane and a lot of what they're doing with the An-2 upgrades is leading up to that but it will all demand on commercial demand.