Russia successfully tests hypersonic ICBM

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omegasigma

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December 24, 2004 23:26 IST
(Link: http://us.rediff.com/news/2004/dec/24russia.htm)

Russia on Saturday successfully tested its Generation-next hypersonic inter-continental ballistic missile (ICBM) capable of dodging any future missile shield.

In the presence of Defence Minister Sergei Ivanov and Economic Development Minister Gherman Gref, a RS12M2 Topol-M mobile ICBM was test launched at 1239 hours (1509 IST) from the cosmodrome Plisetsk in north Russia.

Twenty-five minutes later it scored a bulls-eye 6,000 kilometres away at the Kura range in Kamchatka in the far east, the defence ministry said.

This was the fourth successful test of the new missile before its induction in 2005.

Topol-M ICBMs will become the 'backbone' of the Russian nuclear missile forces by 2015 and are expected to be in service till 2040. Equipped with three powerful engines, they are capable of penetrating through multi-layered enemy missile defences.

In November, addressing his top generals, President Vladimir Putin had shocked the world by announcing plans to shortly deploy 'unique missiles capable of penetrating any future missile defence systems under development' in the US.

In the late 1980s, responding to US president Ronald Regan's 'Star Wars' plans, the then Soviet president Mikhail Gorbachev had cautioned that the USSR will take 'asymmetrical' measures, which would turn the US missile shield costing hundreds of billion dollars into a 'useless toy'.

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omegasigma

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Re: Russia successfully tests hypersonic ICBM

I think this spells trouble for the already troubled US anti-missile defence initiative. The Topol platform is proving very good for the Russians. Recently I heard that the Japanese government has agreed to join the United States for the anti-missile defence program.
 
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armage

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Big deal there will always be counter and anti-counter to ICBMs and
missile, soon the US will claim that they developed a counter-measure to that, and then Russia or some other country will say they develped a counter to tthat counter measure.....
Just a endless game of chess with no checkmate......
 
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omegasigma

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armage said:
Big deal there will always be counter and anti-counter to ICBMs and
missile, soon the US will claim that they developed a counter-measure to that, and then Russia or some other country will say they develped a counter to tthat counter measure.....
Just a endless game of chess with no checkmate......
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There is no proven counter-measure right now even to the oldest ICBMs in existence. The only counter-measure is MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction.) If someone builds a anti-missile defence (the US is still unsuccessfully trying to build one) it changes the zero-sumness of the game. Russia is trying to go one step further.
 
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armage

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Just wait a couple of decades or a hundread year and see anti-matter weapons come into play, that's when it really starts to get exciting......
 
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adsH

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better luck next time the US is in the process of working out the possible problems it would encounter. If anyone one can counter a wepon it has to be the US, with its massive funding for research it is is the greatest Military machine on the face of this earth and it does mean business when its warfare.
the key is to Take down the ICBM before it is aloud to reach its terminal stage, which means the US has to place missile system interceptors around the world and interconnect them, to take them down asoon as they are launched.
when ever there will be a weapon there will be a counter weapon, its jut a matter of time. Necessity is the mother of all inventions.
 
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armage

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What about that aircraft that the 747 with the laser cone on it that shoots down ICBM, do you use that in the boost phasee or when the warhead zooms towards the earth?
 
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omegasigma

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armage said:
What about that aircraft that the 747 with the laser cone on it that shoots down ICBM, do you use that in the boost phasee or when the warhead zooms towards the earth?
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Please can you provide a online reference to this 747-mounted laser technology? I have not yet seen a credible source for this except in some popular science kind of magazines.
 
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adsH

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thats the Aussie Crazy weapon!! Laser AC. But anyways you Omegasigma seam to be more inclined towards seeing the Us fail in protecting itself from the Comunist Russia. I would of thought you living in that country would have grown to love your country.

Failures in test of new weapon systems occur quiet often (free media allows you to share the info) its the lessons learnt from those mistakes that prepare you for the future. the US is pioneering the tech allong wiht its global research partners, with cutting edge tech on there side i have no doubt that we will find ways of protecting our selves from the eastern Blocks.
 
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highsea

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Well, in the first place, NMD was never intended to replace MAD. It's not about deterring Russia, as everyone knows if Russia and the US go at it, there is no tomorrow anyway.

The SS-N-27 and the sub launched version, the SS-N-30 are mobile versions of the SS-N-25 Topol. They are nothing new, the sub launched version has yet to be successfully fired, but the cold launching portion (ejection of a dummy missile) has been successfully tested.

I have a lot of scepticism about claims of course adjustments or "evasive manouvers" in terminal phase, think about it for a minute and you will see why. What makes them hard to stop is two things. First they are mobile, so they can't be pre-targeted for boost phase interception. Second, they are very well shielded against EMP, so mid course interception essentially requires a direct hit. They are not MIRV's, but they may have decoys and a certain amount of resistance to jamming. A MIRV version was reported to be in the planning stage, but it would mean that some of the EMP shielding would have to go. So it's a tradeoff.

NMD is a lot more than the ground based interceptor. There are lots of discussions here on the subject. Boost phase interception includes Theater defence systems like PAC-3, THAAD, ship launched systems like SM-3, and airborne systems like ABL.

Mid course interception is dependent on the ground based interceptor now under testing, and future space based systems. All of the systems have a certain degree of overlap.

Terminal defence goes back the TMD type defences and interception from AC. Eventually ground based directed energy systems will be incorporated.

It's not a "one size fits all" system, and the Topol-M is irrelevant to NMD anyway, as Russia will not sell them to third world countries.

And every country uses ABM systems, PAC-3, Arrow, S-300/400, etc. It's just that the US is building a more comprehensive system that will also protect our allies in Western Europe, Canada, Japan, South Korea, Australia, etc.
 
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omegasigma

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omegasigma

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adsH said:
thats the Aussie Crazy weapon!! Laser AC. But anyways you Omegasigma seam to be more inclined towards seeing the Us fail in protecting itself from the Comunist Russia. I would of thought you living in that country would have grown to love your country.

Failures in test of new weapon systems occur quiet often (free media allows you to share the info) its the lessons learnt from those mistakes that prepare you for the future. the US is pioneering the tech allong wiht its global research partners, with cutting edge tech on there side i have no doubt that we will find ways of protecting our selves from the eastern Blocks.
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I live in a real world. I love my country. The freedom to critique is what makes our country great. My country has won the cold war and will maintain it's edge because of the freedom we have here.
 
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highsea

New Member
omegasigma said:
Nice website, nice flash, no info. It would be nice if defence was achieved just by drawing nice pictures.
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I provided you with the link you requested as a starting point. Maybe you didn't really take a good look. There is quite a bit of general information, design details, info on the test schedule, as well as five years of press releases, pictures and videos on the Boeing site. You can find more infomation by going to the manufacturers of the subsystems and reading their press releases. (NG and LM)

I don't know what kind of info are you looking for, but there is quite a lot available online. You are not going to get anything classified, but testing schedules, general design details, etc. is all there.

The AC made several test flights prior to the removal of the COIL and setup at Edwards for full power tests. Right now they have fitted the targeting and tracking lasers and the beam and fire control systems, and are in a series of flight tests to prove them out. When that is concluded, the COIL will be re-installed and full power flight tests will begin. This should happen sometime next summer, barring any mishaps.

The COIL has already been through a series of low power tests at Edwards. The overall concept has been approved through the EMD phase, and the first shootdown tests of a BMD should happen next year.

The program is a bit farther along than the "nice pictures" stage.
 
gf0012-aust

gf0012-aust

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omegasigma said:
armage said:
What about that aircraft that the 747 with the laser cone on it that shoots down ICBM, do you use that in the boost phasee or when the warhead zooms towards the earth?
Click to expand...
Please can you provide a online reference to this 747-mounted laser technology? I have not yet seen a credible source for this except in some popular science kind of magazines.
Click to expand...
Actually there is substantial information available that I have seen at various EW confernences in the last 2 years, None of that is in the public domain.

I actually don't take much stock on what I see in the public domain as it is available for a reason.

For example, the last sub warfare conference i attended in October 2004, over 95% of the technologies discussed in various sessions did not appear in the public domain. Some of these weapons systems are already beyong the test development stage and are capable of being deployed if "war was declared tomorrow". I have a 1200+ page conference book which details over 35 new technologies under development. Only 3 are in the public domain - and even those 3 you wouldn't discuss so as not to bring attention to them. It may seem bizaare to some in here, but that is how it all works in these areas.

I think it's pertinent to remember is that there are a few of us in here with security clearances who would not say anything even if technologies were blatantly misrepresented in capability. For those who have not worked in a military environment at such levels it is almost incomprehensible to understand that - but it is the case. In the majority of professional militaries, nobody will talk about anything that can't be cleared safely - irrespective of the fact that they can defend what is being said.
 
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redsoulja

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well so highseas the NMD is built only to stop nuclear missiles from rogue countries that have small arsenals and can't compete against countries with larger arsenals right??
 
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