Royal New Zealand Navy Discussions and Updates

[alexsa]

A drillship or drilling platform would be needed for that, which would be a major undertaking, but after the wells have bred drilled going unmanned and subsea would be the safest option IMO, there’s no need for a manned platform if you can get away without one.

Except for the fact you do need to move the oil or gas from that site to a process point. I doubt there is any technology in use at the moment that allows this to be done from subsea for 100's of kilometres (noting it is practical to lay very loing pipes lines but you still need to move the product. Subsea structure certainly does join up the wells in a field and this is used in conjuction with floating or fixed infrastructure. In the NW shelf area there are still platforms or floating facilties simply to move product ashore or into offtake tankers.

 

[KiwiRob]

Except for the fact you do need to move the oil or gas from that site to a process point. I doubt there is any technology in use at the moment that allows this to be done from subsea for 100's of kilometres (noting it is practical to lay very loing pipes lines but you still need to move the product. Subsea structure certainly does join up the wells in a field and this is used in conjuction with floating or fixed infrastructure. In the NW shelf area there are still platforms or floating facilties simply to move product ashore or into offtake tankers.

It's been done before, the Ormen Lange gas field is entirely subsurface, it's 24 wellheads transport the gas via undersea pipe to the Nyhamma processing plant, the pipeline is 120km long.

 

[alexsa]

It's been done before, the Ormen Lange gas field is entirely subsurface, it's 24 wellheads transport the gas via undersea pipe to the Nyhamma processing plant, the pipeline is 120km long.

Yep, you are correct and it is 75nm with what appears to be an upward gradient from the well heads. Not sure how that would work with oil and an undulating seabed.

 

[ASSAIL]

It's been done before, the Ormen Lange gas field is entirely subsurface, it's 24 wellheads transport the gas via undersea pipe to the Nyhamma processing plant, the pipeline is 120km long.

In the case of the Ichthys project in NW Western Australia the gas being transported ashore must be piped 890kms to Darwin. This requires it to be compressed and processed in a 336 mtr FPSO (floating production, storage and offloading unit)

Ichthys in detail

I simply offer this example as an illustration of the level of complexity required for a major offshore LNG project and although the Ichthys field is designed to withstand the odd Cyclone I would be surprised if such an endeavour could be established in the near Antarctic of NZs southern EEZ.

 

[Whiplash34]

Just to get things back on track a little (though not taking anything away from the up-skilling in geology I have received.....!) .... here is a recent picture of HMNZS Aotearoa tied up and progressing towards the backend of her fit out..... from the WONZ forum



Linky= A huge new Navy ship, HMNZS Aotearoa | Wings Over New Zealand

 

[KiwiRob]

Yep, you are correct and it is 75nm with what appears to be an upward gradient from the well heads. Not sure how that would work with oil and an undulating seabed.

But don't they believe most of what's under the Southern Basin is gas not oil?

 

[spoz]

Shoe laces are tied up, ships are secured.....and I still can’t get used to that bow.

 

[Whiplash34]

Shoe laces are tied up, ships are secured.....and I still can’t get used to that bow.

Ha! I actually laughed out loud when I read that. Thanks for setting me straight. Learning occurred.

 

[Lucasnz]

Out of the major projects report for 2018 - Developments post June 2018 for the ANZAC Frigate upgrade:

The project continued with the refit of Te Kaha with the industrial phase, which involved removal of old equipment and fitting and installation of new equipment, cabling and systems, and the fitting of new masts. In June 2019 the completion date for the industrial refit was adjusted to October 2019, a four month variation that reflects the complexity of the upgrade and the extent of differences between the Halifax- and Anzac- class frigates. This will lead to an acceptance of Initial Operational Capability in September 2020. Te Mana has arrived in Victoria, Canada to prepare for the industrial refit, which is scheduled to commence on 1 May 2019. The upgrade of the second ship remains on schedule for acceptance in May 2021.

More and more a move back to a 3-4 frigate force has justification.

 

[ASSAIL]

Out of the major projects report for 2018 - Developments post June 2018 for the ANZAC Frigate upgrade:

The project continued with the refit of Te Kaha with the industrial phase, which involved removal of old equipment and fitting and installation of new equipment, cabling and systems, and the fitting of new masts. In June 2019 the completion date for the industrial refit was adjusted to October 2019, a four month variation that reflects the complexity of the upgrade and the extent of differences between the Halifax- and Anzac- class frigates. This will lead to an acceptance of Initial Operational Capability in September 2020. Te Mana has arrived in Victoria, Canada to prepare for the industrial refit, which is scheduled to commence on 1 May 2019. The upgrade of the second ship remains on schedule for acceptance in May 2021.

More and more a move back to a 3-4 frigate force has justification.

What a surprise, the Anzacs are different to the Halifaxs!
I would have thought that this would have been allowed for in the original schedule, the “first” of any major upgrade (this is not a simple carry on from the Halifax upgrades) was always going to take more time.
On the other hand they could have gone to Henderson and been upgrade numbers 9&10 and would have been even quicker because of the platform upgrades already completed in NZ.

 

[t68]

What a surprise, the Anzacs are different to the Halifaxs!
I would have thought that this would have been allowed for in the original schedule, the “first” of any major upgrade (this is not a simple carry on from the Halifax upgrades) was always going to take more time.
On the other hand they could have gone to Henderson and been upgrade numbers 9&10 and would have been even quicker because of the platform upgrades already completed in NZ.

If the Kiwi Anzacs did do the ASMD would they also have to do all the others like enclose the stern like the RAN Anzacs?

If so would it still been cost effective?

 

[ASSAIL]

If the Kiwi Anzacs did do the ASMD would they also have to do all the others like enclose the stern like the RAN Anzacs?

If so would it still been cost effective?

The upgrades to the 8 x Anzacs have cost AUD2.2b and this includes lifetime upgrades.
In for the long haul (part 2): Can the Anzacs remain relevant? | The Strategist

The upgrades for the Two RNZN frigates in Canada has been quoted at $639m (not sure if USD or CD) and that’s just the work done in Canada, it doesn’t include the platform and machinery upgrades completed in NZ or any cost overruns from delays during the current refit.
New Zealand frigate arrives in Canada for major upgrade

In my view that makes the RAN upgrades look pretty cheap by comparison.

 

[Novascotiaboy]

If the monies wasted on the C130H life extension and the monies spent extending the lives of the ANZACs would have been spent on new platforms the NZDF would have been much further ahead. Hopefully lessons learned.

 

[ngatimozart]

Looks like the Canucks are acquiring ship to shore connectors similar to mexeflotes. Maybe the RNZN should look at tagging a couple or three on to the Canuck order.

Canada buying ship-to-shore connectors for its Joint Support Ships

 

[swerve]

Sensible. The Mexeflote idea seems very useful, a good, practical, triumph of utility over glamour.

 

[40 deg south]

Nicholas Drummond on Twitter

An interesting footnote for the RNZN followers here. Nicholas Drummond is a UK defence consultant with a busy twitter feed. In his posts from the DSEI trade show, he has one tweet with a photo of Camell Laird's unsuccessful Leander proposal, plus the legendary Boaty McBoatyface.

I hope the link above will work, but otherwise you can scroll back in his Twitter feed to 11 Sept.

In the discussion the follows, someone identifies a model in the background as Camell Laird's proposal for the NZ dive support/ hydrographic vessel tender, that was eventually cancelled and the Edda Fonn was bought. From the little you can see, this design is similar; front-mounted helipad and huge crane at the rear.

 

[Gibbo]

Nicholas Drummond on Twitter

An interesting footnote for the RNZN followers here. Nicholas Drummond is a UK defence consultant with a busy twitter feed. In his posts from the DSEI trade show, he has one tweet with a photo of Camell Laird's unsuccessful Leander proposal, plus the legendary Boaty McBoatyface.

I hope the link above will work, but otherwise you can scroll back in his Twitter feed to 11 Sept.

In the discussion the follows, someone identifies a model in the background as Camell Laird's proposal for the NZ dive support/ hydrographic vessel tender, that was eventually cancelled and the Edda Fonn was bought. From the little you can see, this design is similar; front-mounted helipad and huge crane at the rear.

Good catch there 40 deg. A very chunky and nice looking design...clearly looks bigger than the new Manawanui but interestingly it suggests that if this is indicative of what most tenders were like then I'd say the RNZN has got 90% of what they wanted... albeit a 2nd hand vessel with a shorter life expectancy. If anyone has looked at the RNZN video of the new Manawanui you'll see it has brand new dive equipment. She has a moonpool (itself a big move forward) with a dive bell & sitting beside that another LARS with an equipment 'basket' that can lower tools etc for divers in the bell.

One question (concern) I do have though is surely extreme caution would have to be exercised to ensure that when both items are deployed underwater that currents don't push the equipment basket into the dive bell or more critically the SSBA umbilicals... is it standard practise to have 2 such items side by side on dive vessels?

 

[ngatimozart]

Good catch there 40 deg. A very chunky and nice looking design...clearly looks bigger than the new Manawanui but interestingly it suggests that if this is indicative of what most tenders were like then I'd say the RNZN has got 90% of what they wanted... albeit a 2nd hand vessel with a shorter life expectancy. If anyone has looked at the RNZN video of the new Manawanui you'll see it has brand new dive equipment. She has a moonpool (itself a big move forward) with a dive bell & sitting beside that another LARS with an equipment 'basket' that can lower tools etc for divers in the bell.

One question (concern) I do have though is surely extreme caution would have to be exercised to ensure that when both items are deployed underwater that currents don't push the equipment basket into the dive bell or more critically the SSBA umbilicals... is it standard practise to have 2 such items side by side on dive vessels?

Am unsure but @KiwiRob will know.

 

[40 deg south]

DSEI 2019: Cammell Laird open to switching Type 31e allegiance - NWI - Naval Warfare - Shephard Media

Slightly clearer shot of the 'proposed for NZ' vessel just behind Leander in this link.

Certainly very much of a type with the second-hand vessel they eventually chose.

 

[ngatimozart]

Now that the Babcock OMT Arrowhead 140 is to be the RN Type 31 FFG, there is talk on the RN thread about NZ acquiring it. It would make quite a bit of sense, especially now that Babcock acknowledge that most of the export will be sales of the design, systems and engineering expertise, rather than actual ships, because most customers will want the ships built in their own yards - see my post here. So if we went down the Type 31 path, we could have it built in South Korean yards, for example, and fitted out to NZ specs and with the pommy price roughly being £250M, about NZ$500M per ship, well within our price range. They are a GP FFG and from what I read in the 2019DCP, and associated documentation, the NZG is expecting the ANZAC frigate replacements to be well over NZ$1 billion per ship. Save the RN has some good details on the Type 31 including an illustration of the proposed layout.


We do have a requirement for a 3rd frigate, sooner rather than later, and on the surface the Type 31 does meet most of our requirements. Of course, we'd have to change a few things, like mount a 5 in gun up forward etc., but that's not a deal breaker. It's most definitely worth have a very close look at.

Another vessel of interest is the newly released BMT concept design ELLIDA Amphibious / Tanker / Multi-Role Auxiliary Vessel. Being 195 m in length, it has a welldock, 2 spot flightdeck, internal vehicle and stowage decks, weather deck stowage and additional accommodation able to undertake landing craft & boat operations, multi-spot aviation and replenishment at sea. It's probably a bit large but could be scaled down to say 135 - 150 m length (Canterbury is 131 m), and it offers significant capability. From the illustrations, it looks like it has a fuel replenishment capability, so would be a back up or Aotearoa when she is unavailable and if it was ice strengthened and winterised to the same level as Aotearoa, could undertake the McMurdo runs the years that Aotearoa doesn't. Again this vessel could be built in a South Korean yard, for example and it has the potential to offer capabilities that would meet the enhanced sealift vessel requirements. It also has very good HADR potential. One definitely worth keeping an eye on.