Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF) News and Discussions

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StobieWan

Super Moderator
Staff member
John Fedup said:
At this stage, it makes no sense for LM to play hardball. The Typhoon and Rafael stand no chance based on recent pricing. More importantly the lack of spares seems to have reduced the readiness rate for Typhoons and Canadian military procurement staff dealing with Dassault....OXYMORON Alert!!

The battle will be between Boeing and LM IMO. Given the 5th Gen technology and a minimal price difference (if any), LM should win unless Boeing cooks up some kind of lucrative ITB package. Junior no doubt hopes this will be the case. In the unlikely event junior loses the next election, the Conservatives will order the F-35. Ontario’s premier, Doug “the thug” Ford will help the federal conservatives as it will benefit Ontario more than Quebec.
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The spares availability for Tiffy is a synthetic issue - a number of members of the Typhoon program (and I'm speaking definitely here of the UK and Germany) haven't ordered spares "in depth" to cut costs - if the Canadian Govt struck a deal with the right parameters, spares would be available I'm sure.

Personally, F35 strikes me as a much better buy in every department but that's just my opinion based on the fact that the Canadian bird would have to carry US compatible secure comms to meet NORAD commitments etc.

Just buy what the big dog in the yard buys, you're guaranteed a lifetime of spares, upgrades, software drops etc.
 
t68

t68

Well-Known Member
StobieWan said:
The spares availability for Tiffy is a synthetic issue - a number of members of the Typhoon program (and I'm speaking definitely here of the UK and Germany) haven't ordered spares "in depth" to cut costs - if the Canadian Govt struck a deal with the right parameters, spares would be available I'm sure.

Personally, F35 strikes me as a much better buy in every department but that's just my opinion based on the fact that the Canadian bird would have to carry US compatible secure comms to meet NORAD commitments etc.

Just buy what the big dog in the yard buys, you're guaranteed a lifetime of spares, upgrades, software drops etc.
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But there PM is not thinking rationally boxing himself into corners
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

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  • #883
Dassault has decided not to bid on the Canadian fighter replacement program. The reason given is the 5-eye security requirements which were going to be expensive and difficult to meet. Again, and I appreciate how comparing various price deals are problematic, the Rafale just doesn't seem to be competitive against either the SH or F-35 which is likely the main reason. One has to wonder what team Saab and team Typhoon think about this.

French firm Dassault pulls out of fighter-jet competition: Sources - 680 NEWS
 
H

hauritz

Well-Known Member
John Fedup said:
Dassault has decided not to bid on the Canadian fighter replacement program. The reason given is the 5-eye security requirements which were going to be expensive and difficult to meet. Again, and I appreciate how comparing various price deals are problematic, the Rafale just doesn't seem to be competitive against either the SH or F-35 which is likely the main reason. One has to wonder what team Saab and team Typhoon think about this.

French firm Dassault pulls out of fighter-jet competition: Sources - 680 NEWS
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If that is the case the Swedes might pull out as well. That would narrow the field to the SH, F-35 and tiffy.

It does seem like the French do have some issues with the Canadian selection process ... first the FREMM and now this.
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

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  • #885
Yep, I think Saab would be wasting their time and realistically so is Team Typhoon. If we wanted something like Typhoon, Boeing would also be offering the strike eagle in addition to the SH. As for the FREMM, the French couldn't accept the tender format which is why we won't likely be buying French subs should the government ever get around to planning a Victoria class replacement.
 
H

hauritz

Well-Known Member
John Fedup said:
Yep, I think Saab would be wasting their time and realistically so is Team Typhoon. If we wanted something like Typhoon, Boeing would also be offering the strike eagle in addition to the SH. As for the FREMM, the French couldn't accept the tender format which is why we won't likely be buying French subs should the government ever get around to planning a Victoria class replacement.
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So realistically back to the SH vs F-35?

Given the toxic relationship that Canada currently has with Boeing I would say LM are sitting pretty at the moment.
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

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  • #887
Yes, at this point it really boils down to Boeing and LM. If aircraft capability is the sole criterion, the choice should be F-35. Pricing differences shouldn't be an issue. Boeing will try to offer a better industrial benefit package equal to or exceeding the value of the fighter program. Will the value of Canadian contracts for F-35 components be able to match this? It might be possible with all the orders coming in. Production should easily reach 3500 jets, perhaps more. However, new customers will be competing for workshare so there is no guarantee Canada's workshare would match the contract value alone. LM may have to throw in some additional work into Canada on other products. Then there is junior......:eek:
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

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  • #888
A request for documents concerning Canada’s fighter gap problem yields nothing. As no documentation exists, clearly there was no capability gap to justify the now cancelled SH purchase. The same applies to the purchase of used Hornets. Another classic example of the Liberals misleading Canadians in order to put off a proper fighter replacement decision. Junior’s Liberal party, the party of lying sacks of shit.

https://nationalpost.com/news/canad...y-gap-claim-used-to-justify-aircraft-purchase
 
t68

t68

Well-Known Member
John Fedup said:
The AG report on junior’s fighter replacement plan has received failing marks. The interim SH (now cancelled) and the used Hornet purchase do not improve capability and keeping our obsolete fleet running until 2030 will cost 3 billion. This amount equates to at least 20 F-35s which would remain active to 2060 at least.

Auditor General exposes major flaws in Trudeau government’s fighter jet plans
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Thanks for diggung up the article, I was wondering how they were going to keep the combat system relevant out to 2030s
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

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  • #891
This article highlights the manpower problems facing the RCAF. The shortage of skilled technicians was well known before and it must difficult attracting new people to work on obsolete kit and then add in the frustration of dealing with parts shortages can’t help. The pilot shortage issue is not unique to the RCAF. Forty pilots leaving per year and only thirty newly trained per year doesn’t bode well for the future. Just a thought but perhaps the prospect of training for a career in new jets which will be in use for 20-30 years might attract more people compared to kit fit for the scrap yard.

Canada’s CF-18s miss NORAD pledge due to personnel shortfall
 
ASSAIL

ASSAIL

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
John Fedup said:
This article highlights the manpower problems facing the RCAF. The shortage of skilled technicians was well known before and it must difficult attracting new people to work on obsolete kit and then add in the frustration of dealing with parts shortages can’t help. The pilot shortage issue is not unique to the RCAF. Forty pilots leaving per year and only thirty newly trained per year doesn’t bode well for the future. Just a thought but perhaps the prospect of training for a career in new jets which will be in use for 20-30 years might attract more people compared to kit fit for the scrap yard.

Canada’s CF-18s miss NORAD pledge due to personnel shortfall
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Im surprised by the statement that the RAAF Hornets will have to be modernised to meet the RCAF standard. i understood from comments here that they were almost identical.
Anyone?
 
M

Milne Bay

Active Member
ASSAIL said:
Im surprised by the statement that the RAAF Hornets will have to be modernised to meet the RCAF standard. i understood from comments here that they were almost identical.
Anyone?
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Is this yet another delaying tactic by the Canadian gov't.
I find it hard to believe that the RAAF hornets are below the standard of the RCAF.
MB
 
oldsig127

oldsig127

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Milne Bay said:
Is this yet another delaying tactic by the Canadian gov't.
I find it hard to believe that the RAAF hornets are below the standard of the RCAF.
MB
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You will probably find that ours have RAAF specific kit which Canada doesn't use. One item that was often quoted as differing in our aircraft was HF radio not much used elsewhere. Guessing that they mean fitting Canadian specific kit rather than upgrading the other 95% of the Hornet

oldsig
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

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  • #895
Whatever required specific Canadian kit will take ages to install given the shortage of qualified technicians.
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

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  • #899
The only thing junior will have FOC on by 2026 will be the legal team to defend any procurement decision. This is only because it is being assembled now to defend the RCN's CSC decision.:D
 
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