Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates

[ASSAIL]

It’s good to see the Hydrographers working hard and deployed overseas throughout the region. Four ships deployed to Sri Lanka, to the Solomons and to Manus area PNG. It must be a pleasant change after plodding around the coastal areas for so long.

Hydrographic ships on-task overseas

 

[spoz]

Yes, a mate of mine did I think 9 deployments - all to the Joseph Bonaparte Gulf! Mind you, I'm not sure that the droggies are quite the pirates they were in our day, I hear they actually wear uniform at sea occasionally!

Have we heard how the search for Vampire went? Unsuccessful or not yet concluded, presumably, I imagine it would have been in the news if she had been found

 

[ASSAIL]

Yes, a mate of mine did I think 9 deployments - all to the Joseph Bonaparte Gulf! Mind you, I'm not sure that the droggies are quite the pirates they were in our day, I hear they actually wear uniform at sea occasionally!

Have we heard how the search for Vampire went? Unsuccessful or not yet concluded, presumably, I imagine it would have been in the news if she had been found

The search was unsuccessful

Baird Maritime - Search for HMAS Vampire ends with no trace of lost warship

 

[Massive]

the 9LV operator and sensor interface will be used as standard to reduce the training burden as seaman move from ship to ship.

Thanks for this Steve.

Makes a lot of sense - very interesting.

Regards,

Massive

 

[hauritz]

The case for an unmanned Australian warship - Australian Defence Magazine

The RAAF has been pushing the development and acquisition of unmanned aircraft pretty hard in recent years. When I look at the navy all I am really seeing are a number of relatively conservative shipbuilding projects that are still decades away from fruition. In fact these projects are being pushed out so far that I find myself wondering just how effective some of the technology will be when it eventually comes online.

Australia will always have problems building and manning sufficient numbers of warships in the face of massive powers such as China so maybe it is time the navy took a leaf from the RAAF playbook and start looking at cheaper unmanned options instead of conventional warships.

If any country should be taking the lead in these sorts of programs then it is Australia. With its vast ocean approaches and exorbitant manpower costs this would seem the obvious action to take.

 

[spoz]

I suggest you take a look at this:

AUTONOMOUS WARRIOR 2018 a milestone in allied cooperation

or google "autonomous RAN" or "usv RAN". Needless to say, what is in the public arena is limited.

 

[Tasman]

Just wondering if we have a sub shadowing the task force?
I would like to think we have this protection when we have major assets abroad

Whilst it doesn't tell us whether an Australian submarine was 'shadowing' the task force HMAS Collins has joined it in India for AUSINDEX-19.

Royal Australian Navy Ships and Submarine at Visakhapatnam India to participate in AUSINDEX-19

Tas

 

[koala]

And the Navy has made It quite clear via media release over the last few weeks that four of the six are currently operational, crewed and worked up.

Thanks for the reply team.
Would it be fair to say that out of 6 subs to have 1 in maintenance, 1 in workup and 4 operational would be an outstanding achievement.
We will never know what happens with the silent service but the mind wanders thinking on what covert operations they have been tasked with of late?
I would dearly think they are going well, but as a novice would like some better understanding from a defence pro.
Thanks Chris

 

[pussertas]

Funnel less Frigate,

From "Save the Royal Navy" website.

What no funnel?
The A-200 makes a valuable space saving by channeling the engine exhaust to an outlet in the stern of the ship. The lack of funnel and uptakes in the center of the ship frees up space for more above-deck weapons and accommodation. The entire propulsion system can be sited further aft than in most conventional warship designs and this allows for unbroken areas for useful payload that extend over 66% of the of ship’s length. The ships are exceptionally quiet and vibration-free as a result of the lack of a vertical funnel and uptakes amidships, which is a significant noise source in conventional layouts.

(Left) Close up of the A-200 stern showing the water-jet and reverse thrust bucket. (Right) Exhaust gases from both the diesels and gas turbine are cooled with seawater helping to reduce the infrared signature.

@pussertas You post some good material but you have been asked before to provide links to online material. In future please do so or suffer the wrath of the Moderators. Ngatimozart.

 

[spoz]

This would seem more relevant in the RN discussion.

The same advantages (in terms of machinery location), in fact more so, are available to electric drive ships. Optimal weight distribution and ability to easily support foundations are usually at least as important as shaft length or exhaust location when determining a design.

It would be interesting to experience the design in a pitching situation which submerges the stern; back pressure would be a problem that would have to be dealt with.

I’m not sure I buy the noise/vibration statement.

 

[alexsa]

This would seem more relevant in the RN discussion.

The same advantages (in terms of machinery location), in fact more so, are available to electric drive ships. Optimal weight distribution and ability to easily support foundations are usually at least as important as shaft length or exhaust location when determining a design.

It would be interesting to experience the design in a pitching situation which submerges the stern; back pressure would be a problem that would have to be dealt with.

I’m not sure I buy the noise/vibration statement.

I share your raised eyebrows on 'lower noise' as the water flow noise (simply from the impact of the water stream into the wake) is pretty impressive on most of water jet systems I have seen. Funnels can actually direct noise to atmosphere if properly designed.

Would love to see something how lower noise and vibrations is achieved (they may be referring to propeller driven operation?).

 

[ngatimozart]

This would seem more relevant in the RN discussion.

The same advantages (in terms of machinery location), in fact more so, are available to electric drive ships. Optimal weight distribution and ability to easily support foundations are usually at least as important as shaft length or exhaust location when determining a design.

It would be interesting to experience the design in a pitching situation which submerges the stern; back pressure would be a problem that would have to be dealt with.

I’m not sure I buy the noise/vibration statement.

Yes I agree about the pitching especially in roughers and also during a crash stop. Salt water in the engines isn't good for them, however if they used systems like SSK snorkel systems that could solve that problem.

 

[ASSAIL]

Yes I agree about the pitching especially in roughers and also during a crash stop. Salt water in the engines isn't good for them, however if they used systems like SSK snorkel systems that could solve that problem.

Actually, water jets are fantastic for “crash stops” in fact almost instantaneous.
I suspect that the jet would not be used during rough seas and it would rely entirely on the twin propellers.
Noise must be a problem, the amount of water being churned and funnelled is humongous, just look at the wake of the various Austal built jet ships, both commercial and USN to determine that, it makes cavitation look like silent prayer.

 

[Meriv90]

About the funnel:
Kedah Class: Issues in The Future.. - Malaysian Defence

I don't know if it is about this specific exhaust but the SA didnt have a good experience with the Meko

Teuteberg said the “starboard propulsion unit on one of the frigates is broken. An investigation subsequently discovered a shortcoming on an underwater exhaust valve, the South African Press Association reported. But Sisulu in her answer – drafted by Teuteberg – states it was the port diesel. The cause of the damage was “ingress of water through the exhaust system and due to sensor failure. This was caused by normal wear and tear.”

The admiral last year amplified that the Navy believed “this to be a design shortcoming, but particular to the sea states we operate in. It happened when the vessel was rolling excessively and therefore the pressure changed as the exhaust went down. And there was water ingress… to the engine, [which] damaged the crankshaft of this engine,” he said.

 

[Jack Wyatt]

This morning I purchased a copy of "Australian Warship" magazine expecting great things. Some nice photography throughout the magazine but what interested me was the article on the Arafura Class. The article answered a series of questions one of which dealt with the possibility of additional units being ordered as replacements for the Huon class mine hunters. Unfortunately the answer included "Depending which political party". When both major parties have committed to 2% expenditure of GDP on Defence with Bill Shorten reaffirming that commitment in his reply speech last night, you would think the public could expect better.

As for the names of the patrol boats, Bass, Kakadu, Kimberley, and Carpentaria would equally be excellent names for the Hunter Class.

 

[Massive]

Just to balance out some of the negativity on political change and defence - the move to 12 submarines, the Arafura class etc came from the Rudd government.

Not a political statement - merely wanting to point out that Labour governments aren't inevitably bad for defence.

Regards,

Massive

 

[weegee]

I saw this article on navaltoday.com about the Australian task group heading/arriving in India recently but what caught my eye was the photo they used on the article.

It is a bloody good sight seeing our Navy in such healthy form. Doing as many exercises with as many ships as we do! The pride meter is working overtime haha

 

[ASSAIL]

ABC Brisbane were aboard HMAS Brisbane for her entry up the river, under tha Gateway bridge to alongside HMAS Moreton.
The quite long video attached also includes some interesting internal film of the ship.
I’m sad to say however, that the correct way to bring a hawser to a double bollard is either not being taught and supervised or totally ignored. It also seems that the old tradition of shaving each morning has been dumped. I’m not sure of her programme but maybe she’s off to the US and many young sailors have sought permission to cease shaving.

Royal Australian Navy

 

[SteveR]

Just to balance out some of the negativity on political change and defence - the move to 12 submarines, the Arafura class etc came from the Rudd government.

Not a political statement - merely wanting to point out that Labour governments aren't inevitably bad for defence.

Regards,

Massive

Yes, but as Rudd supporters leaked to Laurie Oakes during the 2010 election, Gillian when Deputy PM showed little interest in Defence and would often skip National Defence meetings she was invited to. Once in power, in her attempt to rebalance the budget, her choice was to slash Defence spending while maintaining spending on Public Education (a State not Federal responsibility) and other favourite programs on the left. The same happened under Whitlam and then the worthy 1987 White Paper went backwards as Kim Beazley was overruled by his Treasurer and PM. Labor speaks boldly but never acts on their promises.

 

[ngatimozart]

Actually, water jets are fantastic for “crash stops” in fact almost instantaneous.
I suspect that the jet would not be used during rough seas and it would rely entirely on the twin propellers.
Noise must be a problem, the amount of water being churned and funnelled is humongous, just look at the wake of the various Austal built jet ships, both commercial and USN to determine that, it makes cavitation look like silent prayer.

OFF TOPIC. Oh yes crash tops in jet boats great fun and also "Hamilton Turns" as well. Done many a trip in jet boats on various South Island, NZ, rivers & lakes during the days of my ill spent youth. V8 petrol engines were the preferred power plants and they'd go like the clappers. If you did half the things now that were done back then, they'd lock you up and throw the keys away.