Royal Australian Air Force [RAAF] News, Discussions and Updates
Todjaeger
Potstirrer
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #6,302
I did find and re-read the original article, it can be found here. The article itself mentioned JSOW, SDB II, and likely JSM as potential load outs for maritime strike roles, but again there was no mention of what the load out was for the graphic which listed a 500 n mile and 1,000 n mile coloured line, under which it said F-35 combat radius with and without a single air-to-air refueling.
When one mentions Combat Radius, the aircraft configuration does become rather important. After all, a 760 n mile combat radius with an air defence role would mean SFA if the tasking were actually an anti-shipping or maritime strike role.
OTOH, if the mission load out was to include a pair of 1,200 L drop tanks (which would be ~23% increase in carried fuel) and a LRASM, plus some AMRAAM's carried internally in addition to max internal fuel.
For those who read the article, keep in mind it is nearly five years old so some of the thoughts and concerns then are no longer valid.
I would also be interested in what people think about the article now. The impression I got from what the author wrote is that he felt the F-35 was going to be selected, but he was rather unenthusiastic about it.
I also found it curious how the author seemed to attribute decisions made for/by the RAAF to being influenced by problems with the F-35 programme, when that does not match the timeline of events. I am specifically referring to the decision to make the interim strike purchase of the F/A-18F Super Hornets to replace the F-111C's which were to be replaced earlier than planned.
When I checked the time frames, even if the F-35A did become available for service in 2012, there would still have been a gap of about 2-3 years between the early F-111C retirement and the F-35A entry into service. As it was, the SHornet was basically the only new aircraft that the RAAF could get and have start entering service in time.
SpazSinbad
Active Member
Thanks for finding the PDF. A direct link is: https://s3-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/ad-aspi/import/SI70_F35_decision.pdf (1.9Mb) Currently there are NO drop tanks for the F-35 variants. A few years ago now Israel was in cahoots with LM about producing same but nothing since. The added range is not thought to be significant with weight/drag of tanks so development from the original partner side (not Israel) was stopped. I'll go read the PDF again now (five years - how time flies). I would assume any mention of 'F-35 combat radius' will include the weapons as noted in the SAR (btw there should be a new one soon). As for range of any kind with any loadouts other than the KPP [unless another example(s) may be found elsewhere] - good luck with that - NATOPS or Flight Manuals may have that info - let me know when you have your hands on one. 
An old Norwegian F-35 Briefing PDF has a JSM combat range graphic whilst some old USN? PDFs have the B/C info but IIRC that is similar to the SARs of that era. I'll find the Norsk JSM....
An Israeli LM PDF brief had this graphic for F-35A 760NM Combat Radius with Internal Air to Air Configuration:
http://i.imgur.com/jMDocjY.png
An old Norwegian F-35 Briefing PDF has a JSM combat range graphic whilst some old USN? PDFs have the B/C info but IIRC that is similar to the SARs of that era. I'll find the Norsk JSM....An Israeli LM PDF brief had this graphic for F-35A 760NM Combat Radius with Internal Air to Air Configuration:
http://i.imgur.com/jMDocjY.png
Todjaeger
Potstirrer
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #6,305
There is a mention of a dedicated anti-shipping weapon to be integrated onto the F-35 in the early 2020'2 but no mention of what it is supposed to be. Which means no idea on weight, size, or placement aboard an F-35. That last one could be significant since external stores would not only compromise LO efforts, but also increase drag and therefore reduce range, max speed, etc.
I found what appears to be a new SAR, which is were I got a combat radius of 669 n miles for the F-35A while carrying a pair of AIM-120 missiles and JDAM bombs. As for the graphic, that might the load out as well, but without mentioning and specifying one does not really know.Thanks for finding the PDF. A direct link is: https://s3-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/ad-aspi/import/SI70_F35_decision.pdf (1.9Mb) Currently there are NO drop tanks for the F-35 variants. A few years ago now Israel was in cahoots with LM about producing same but nothing since. The added range is not thought to be significant with weight/drag of tanks so development from the original partner side (not Israel) was stopped. I'll go read the PDF again now (five years - how time flies). I would assume any mention of 'F-35 combat radius' will include the weapons as noted in the SAR (btw there should be a new one soon). As for range of any kind with any loadouts other than the KPP [unless another example(s) may be found elsewhere) - good luck with that - NATOPS or Flight Manuals may have that info - let me know when you have your hands on one.
SpazSinbad
Active Member
The DATE on that SAR page is important. Often the pages have different dates usually older than the front page date of that particular SAR (I guess the info had not changed so it was just copy that page again). I don't dispute the info - I have a recent last year SAR but for the moment here is the Norwegian JSM / F-35A graphic:
Meanwhile latest 2019 President Budget SAR KPP mashup page is attached from:
http://www.f-16.net/forum/download/file.php?id=27020 (PDF 0.7Mb)
http://norway.usembassy.gov/root/pdfs/volume-1---executive-summary---part-1_dista.pdf (PDF is around somewhere else if not on F-16.net in the F-35 sub-forum)
Meanwhile latest 2019 President Budget SAR KPP mashup page is attached from:
http://www.f-16.net/forum/download/file.php?id=27020 (PDF 0.7Mb)
http://norway.usembassy.gov/root/pdfs/volume-1---executive-summary---part-1_dista.pdf (PDF is around somewhere else if not on F-16.net in the F-35 sub-forum)
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SpazSinbad
Active Member
Jeepers looking up old internet stuff can be time consuming. AFAIK the two page [now + 1 for three pages] PDF attached came from another PDF no longer available of course but same pages are in this available PDF 4.6Mb JSF - Inventing the Joint Strike Fighter by Dr. Paul Bevilaqua 11 Dec 2009 Lockheed Martin Skunk Works. One would have to realise that these pages are almost a decade old using even older info I would guess. However they are of interest to any 'drop tankers'. Mostly people point out the drop tanks are in the fuselage & stealthy already. First graphic is from the Bevilaqua PDF which also has the Meyer graphics. http://www.aereo.jor.br/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Joint-strike-fighter-Presentation.pdf [the other MEYER PDF is no longer at this URL: http://www.nps.edu/Academics/Institutes/Meyer/docs/Joint strike fighter.pdf ]
SpazSinbad
Active Member
This badge was concocted by artisans at LM at the time of the 'clubbed like baby seals' imbroglio.
Interestingly MDBA is advertising its Meteor (and a graphic including an F-35) on the Australian Defence Magazine - Australian Defence Magazine site.
It's may be drawing a long bow to assume that MDBA advertising its wares on an Australian defence related site implies an intention to sell that product to the RAAF but I can't help doing just that.....
I've not heard or read anything about RAAF looking for a new or supplemental BVR AAM.
Is there a case for AIM120(D) and Meteor for the RAAF?
cheers
rb
It's may be drawing a long bow to assume that MDBA advertising its wares on an Australian defence related site implies an intention to sell that product to the RAAF but I can't help doing just that.....
I've not heard or read anything about RAAF looking for a new or supplemental BVR AAM.
Is there a case for AIM120(D) and Meteor for the RAAF?
cheers
rb
Is the European Meteor Air-To-Air Missile Really the Best in the World?
This article provides some comparisons of the missiles
This article provides some comparisons of the missiles
MARKMILES77
Active Member
Can't read the article due to paywall but appears that the RAAF may fit AN/AAQ-28(V) LITENING targeting pods, taken from retiring(sold) FA-18A/Bs to it's C-130Js.
Not sure of the purpose?
Simply so they can operate as an extra surveillance asset if required?
Or are they contemplating some sort of "Harvest Hawk" C-130 Gunship?
40 deg south
Well-Known Member
Australia begins SOF helo transition from Black Hawk to MRH90 | Jane's 360
A little bit more info from Janes on SOF moving onto the MRH90 platform.
From memory, about a year ago there was talk (from the French end) on Australia and France cooperating on modifications to the platform to adapt if for SOF uses.
A little bit more info from Janes on SOF moving onto the MRH90 platform.
From memory, about a year ago there was talk (from the French end) on Australia and France cooperating on modifications to the platform to adapt if for SOF uses.
John Newman
The Bunker Group
Saw this bit of news last night:
First two used Australian fighter jets arrive in Canada on Sunday
It appears that the first two RAAF Classic Hornets are to be handed over to the RCAF this weekend.
I wonder if these two jets are not coming direct from here in Oz, but are two of the six Classic Hornets that are in the US for Red Flag??
Cheers,
First two used Australian fighter jets arrive in Canada on Sunday
It appears that the first two RAAF Classic Hornets are to be handed over to the RCAF this weekend.
I wonder if these two jets are not coming direct from here in Oz, but are two of the six Classic Hornets that are in the US for Red Flag??
Cheers,
Why would they take two of the best remaining legacy Hornets to Red Flag and hand them over, when the Canadians will be tearing out a lot of the avionics and replacing them with Canadian pattern equipment?
Bit unlikely. I'd think that they'll be aircraft which are in good nick but not fully up to date, and probably with RAAF specific kit removed (where not required for the journey)
oldsig
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
This link mentions 6 Classics from 77 squadron RAAF were sent to Red Flag. If only 4 return to OZ I guess the other two are going to Cold Lake AB today. If not, different Classics are coming directly from Australia.
A Last Hurrah for RAAF Hornets at Red Flag - Second Line of Defense
A Last Hurrah for RAAF Hornets at Red Flag - Second Line of Defense
John Newman
The Bunker Group
Looks like my guess was correct, the first jets handed over are two of the six that were that were at Red Flag:
First two Australian F-18s for the RCAF arrive in Cold Lake – here are the photos
From the photos, the airframe that is identifiable is A21-53, one of the last As built, delivered to the RAAF in December 1989.