sierrahotel
New Member
Greek Goverment is one step from deciding the type of the new fighter aircraft for the Hellenic Air Force (HAF).Eurofighter,Rafale,Gripen,JSF or more F-16B 52+?What do you think?
New fighters for Greece.
- Thread starter sierrahotel
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Hopefully Rafale or EF2000. Gripen is too small, We already have plenty of F-16s and need something even better, JSF no way.
sierrahotel
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There is an exhibition about defence technology taking place this weekend in El.Venizelos Airport called "Athens International 08".French brought a Rafale for demo and Lockheed Martin arranged an F-16 (perhaps a Greek one) in order to promote a deal for F-16B52+ Advanced for now and F-35 for 2014.In addition French signed a contract for Rafale electronics with greek Miltech,while HAF and FAF arranged a joint F-16/Rafale exercise called "Aegean Gust".On the other hand EADS couldn't manage to bring an EF2000 for demo as it was planned, while a part of the greek press asserts that the deal with the Germans lacks supporters in the Goverment and looses ground.
exercise called "Aegean
A friend pass this onto me is this the same event?
From May 12 to 16th 5 Rafales ( 2 c's and 3 B's) will be visiting 337 sqdr and do some common exercises.
In other words, this is Rafale vs F-16 blk52, so the results will be more than interesting....
In a parallel event, 2 F/A-18 E from carrier Truman, will pay a visit in Tanagra air base and do some exercises along with Greek M2000 EBG....
A friend pass this onto me is this the same event?
From May 12 to 16th 5 Rafales ( 2 c's and 3 B's) will be visiting 337 sqdr and do some common exercises.
In other words, this is Rafale vs F-16 blk52, so the results will be more than interesting....
In a parallel event, 2 F/A-18 E from carrier Truman, will pay a visit in Tanagra air base and do some exercises along with Greek M2000 EBG....
sierrahotel
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- #5
Yes,I was talking about the common training between 337 "Ghost"Sqn and 1/7 "Provence".I will post an update on that in a couple of days.The 2 F-18 from Truman were landed last Sunday at Andravida AFB (F-4 AUP)but I don't think that the DACT with M2000 took place.The really interesting news is exercise "Glorius Spartan" begining at the end of the month.A joint HAF-IAF training including 50+ F-16I and F-15Is performing bomb runs in greek fire ranges,DACT with HAF F-16B52+ from Suda AFB and CSAR demo with IAF CH-53/HH-60 and HAF AS-332s along with special forces.
Atilla [TR]
New Member
Any of you guys think that Greece could get Russian airplanes?
sierrahotel
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- #7
Russian fighters are out of the question.New infrastructure,new weapons,different training philosophy and of course new tactical employment will raise the cost and the time that Sukhois will be fully operational.
The exercise between the Mirages and the 2 F-18e/f did happen and I heard a comment that the Americans saw everything (ta idan ola) the Greeks understand the expression.
No there is no chance that we are buying Russian fighters for the reasons mentioned above and for the simple reason that such a program with such a huge budget also has political significance. I think that the fighters will go to the Germans while the frigates will go to the French this way we keep everyone happy except the Americans of course that have been pulling our leg for a long time and now will pay the price....or should I probably say that the wont get paid... They will have to wait till 2014-15 for us to buy another American fighter and of course I am referring to the JSF that we will buy sure as hell....
No there is no chance that we are buying Russian fighters for the reasons mentioned above and for the simple reason that such a program with such a huge budget also has political significance. I think that the fighters will go to the Germans while the frigates will go to the French this way we keep everyone happy except the Americans of course that have been pulling our leg for a long time and now will pay the price....or should I probably say that the wont get paid... They will have to wait till 2014-15 for us to buy another American fighter and of course I am referring to the JSF that we will buy sure as hell....
IrishHitman
New Member
Well, Greece is part of the EU, so politically speaking it should favour European defence companies, unless the Americans offer them JSFs at a favourable price.
Greece buying Russian? Not likely..
Greece buying Russian? Not likely..
Fighters
Greece I think will go EF2000 or Rafale I would rate it at 60/40 toward the EF2000. Greece will lean toward the slightly better fighter of the two I think and the EF2000 has a better rep for that. I don't know if the two ever met in mock combat? I'm interested in reading about all the different fighters the EF2000 and Rafale went up against, so if anybody knows please post it. I like reading stuff like that. I can't find it but I think USN Hornets and Rafale's mixed it up off Frances coast years ago.
Greece buying Russian I don't think so I know a huge natural gas/pipeline contract was just sign between the two and Greece bough I think 400+ BMP-3s but aircraft are a different story. Like other posters mentioned the cost of adding a different type: weapons, training, maintenance & repairs, etc, is just too great. A interesting bit if it did happen t would be another nearby country would have to train against a "third" type of radar guided missile MICA,AIM-120, AA-12, but it won't happen.
Greece I think will go EF2000 or Rafale I would rate it at 60/40 toward the EF2000. Greece will lean toward the slightly better fighter of the two I think and the EF2000 has a better rep for that. I don't know if the two ever met in mock combat? I'm interested in reading about all the different fighters the EF2000 and Rafale went up against, so if anybody knows please post it. I like reading stuff like that. I can't find it but I think USN Hornets and Rafale's mixed it up off Frances coast years ago.
Greece buying Russian I don't think so I know a huge natural gas/pipeline contract was just sign between the two and Greece bough I think 400+ BMP-3s but aircraft are a different story. Like other posters mentioned the cost of adding a different type: weapons, training, maintenance & repairs, etc, is just too great. A interesting bit if it did happen t would be another nearby country would have to train against a "third" type of radar guided missile MICA,AIM-120, AA-12, but it won't happen.
sierrahotel
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- #12
It will be a multi-role fighter like all the existing F-16 , with air superiority to be the key role for the new fighter.
BLACK SHIP
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Please explain to me why my message was deleted.My apologies in advance if offended anyone but since strongly believe that I didn't because IT WAS A GENERAL STATEMENT, with no offending wording , a simple explanation will help clarify if I did broke forum rules .
IrishHitman
New Member
Clearly the mods thought otherwise.....
Anyway, the Greeks can buy all the armour they want from Russia, but aircraft are a whole different league.
multi-role fighter
What sierrahotel said is perfect multi-role fighter but leaning toward air superiority the reason is Greece already a bunch of F-16s for that and F-4s for AG missions. Maybe even A-7s but they might already be in reserve. I believe they use there Mirage 2000-5s in more of a air to air role with some anti-ship duties mixed in. In a way if makes sense the nearby country who has more F-16s then they do would know the F-16 inside and out right? So using the Mirage 2000-5 is different, kind of like having a ace (playing cards) in the hole. It would be some interesting reading hearing a Greece Block-52 pilot and Mirage 2000-5 mk2/3 pilot talk trash about there machines, against each other. I would sit back with a cold one and listen carefully.
On you it sounds like the performence of an A/C depends on the size.
will you please eleborate this further?
Gripen NG, may be, a tiny A/C but it still has an impressive paylaod and range.
Can´t see how Gripen NG is to small for Greece?
Greece is not a very huge country population aprx 5 mill??? so the military budget, can´t be very huge? i think a low LCC would be essential for Greece, gives your pilots more hours in the air. and Turkey goes for the JSF,
Rafale is too expensive for what it can do. and greece might be the only customer. scary and expensive upgrades. EF, sure i love it. would be the best choice, but i still think Gripen NG gives more bang for the bucks
windscorpion
New Member
Its not that small, over 11 million people according to wiki.
BLACK SHIP
New Member
It seems that after past weeks performance of the Rafale at 110 Fighter Wing at
Larisa the slim chances the French had should be consider now non existent.
Larisa the slim chances the French had should be consider now non existent.
Performance
BLACK SHIP do you think that has anything to do with how it might how done testing against a Block-52? I'm sure Greece put the Rafale through tests I know I would have. My two cent for Greece to spend the big money on a Rafale it would have to beat the Viper like 7-3 in air to air to take it on. I think the Mirage 2000-Ds are still marking targets for the Rafale in 2008, think about that a little Block-40 right? Even know the Rafale has a good range and payload, AG would still be the Greece's Vipers main role so it's air to air where the Rafale needed to stand out and shine. Greece has a lot invested in there Viper fleet I can't see them not using them where there suited so well.
BLACK SHIP do you think that has anything to do with how it might how done testing against a Block-52? I'm sure Greece put the Rafale through tests I know I would have. My two cent for Greece to spend the big money on a Rafale it would have to beat the Viper like 7-3 in air to air to take it on. I think the Mirage 2000-Ds are still marking targets for the Rafale in 2008, think about that a little Block-40 right? Even know the Rafale has a good range and payload, AG would still be the Greece's Vipers main role so it's air to air where the Rafale needed to stand out and shine. Greece has a lot invested in there Viper fleet I can't see them not using them where there suited so well.
Yes you´re right. my fault.
but 11 mill, is still small its about the same size as sweden. and greece and sweden have good relations and greece have purchased alot of military equipment and platforms from sweden before IREYE for exampel.