Myanmar Gearing Up?

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
On top of major recent MiG-29 buys (all second hand from Russian inventory), Myanmar has apparently purchased and already received 50 Mi-24 combat helos, 12 Mi-2 transport helos, also all used from Russian inventory, and 50 Chinese K-8 Karakorum combat-trainers.

50 Ìè-24 äëÿ Ìüÿíìû — ÎÐÓÆÈÅ ÐÎÑÑÈÈ, Êàòàëîã âîîðóæåíèÿ, âîåííîé è ñïåöèàëüíîé òåõíèêè

I was wondering if anyone else has heard anything on Myanmar's arms purchases, or what they plan to do with all this hardware.
 

Chino

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
IIRC, there's much bad blood between Burma and the Thais.

And Thailand is probably the most well-armed military in that region.

Burma had always been poorly armed and their focus was on fighting their civil war against the myriad of insurgent groups.

The Karens, IIRC was probably the most formidable until about 10 years ago. And the Karens had unofficial sanctuary on and off in - guess where - Thailand. But I think the Yangon government had more or less defeated the Karens.

(I have a friend whom is of Karen origin, so I know a bit about their struggle.)

The Myanmar government is universally hated by the outside world - myself included - but sometimes I wonder if there is another side to the story...

I mean, a government trying to control a vast territory, sharing a long border with a very hostile neighbor, fighting up to 10 different ethnic-based insurgencies, poverty etc etc... It is not an easy job with no ready solutions.
 

aungkokomyint

New Member
:nutkick I think myanmar army is so poor and have not high technology.
:shudder They did not have modern weapon such as Short range missile or etc;;;;;;;;;
Their navy is weak also as air forces ,:shudder:shudder:unknown
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #4
But these problems have existed for a considerable amount of time. Where as the major purchases are within the last 5 years.
 

Chino

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
But these problems have existed for a considerable amount of time. Where as the major purchases are within the last 5 years.

My theory is simply that the government is feeling more and more paranoid and that not even China, will come to her aid should someone decide to attack them.

I hope someone does.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #6
Interesting. Though these are also all very rapid acquisitions. They're all used, directly from existing inventory. True they're strapped for cash, but the delivery times, and large quantities purchased suggest that the funds involved were significant none-the-less. If they have this kind of money, then they could've reasonably purchased similar quantities of newer equipment, granted long-term contracts. Net program cost would be higher for them, but annual spending wouldn't have to increase that much.

I might be barking at the wind, but it seems like they're crunched for time, and trying to get the bang for the buck on a limited timescale.

EDIT: Apparently they had also acquired notable number of T-55s second hand from India. Same pattern. Bought used, delivered quickly.
 

weasel1962

New Member
Re:

For a state that is willing to shift its capital on short notice....

MYANMAR: MILITARY REGIME’S STRATEGY TO STAY IN POWER

Burma has always been an inward looking society. Even british colonialisation didn't change that. Frictions between Myanmar and Thailand are historical over centuries.

Don't think its hatred rather than legitimacy. People do not recognise the Junta as the true government. Why should there be real "hate" involved when one doesn't even understand the society?

Myanmese arms purchases are primarily for defence. If one has visited myanmar recently, one would realise how suspicious they are over foreign equipment/tech just like the Iranians. So even if the US or UK suddenly offered them the latest arms, they'll still view it with massive suspicion.

Primarily Myanmar has been trying to reassert control over border areas over the past couple of decades. These have prompted civilians refugee issues eg with China and border clashes eg with Thailand (not surprising due to poorly marked borders).

Its not just drug wars but also militants fighting for autonomy, monks protesting the state of the economy and military purges eg Khin Nyunt. Outwardly there is the appearance of a monolithic state but internal divisions are real simmering problems that may be an earthquake just waiting to explode. The risk of coups is high which prompts the junta to be even more hardline and isolationist.

So why would Myanmar buy 20 Migs? May be as simple as a way to spend illegal drug money.
 

Chino

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Don't think its hatred rather than legitimacy. People do not recognise the Junta as the true government. Why should there be real "hate" involved when one doesn't even understand the society?
True, "hate" is too strong a word. They are, after all, nothing like the Khmer Rouge.

I used a strong word because I have a Karen friend, and I naturally sympathize with them, as opposed to being objective.
 

Chino

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Interesting. Though these are also all very rapid acquisitions. .... Same pattern. Bought used, delivered quickly.
The article posted by Weasel also mentioned Myanmar's concern that China now prefers the image of a economic power and may therefore not be a reliable military guarantor of Myanmar's security.

But do you have a theory as to why they seem in a hurry?

Because it is obvious MiG29's have a limited role in COIN. And the insurgencies are anyway considered "manageable" for now according to the article.
 

SABRE

Super Moderator
Verified Defense Pro
On top of major recent MiG-29 buys (all second hand from Russian inventory), Myanmar has apparently purchased and already received 50 Mi-24 combat helos, 12 Mi-2 transport helos, also all used from Russian inventory, and 50 Chinese K-8 Karakorum combat-trainers.

50 Ìè-24 äëÿ Ìüÿíìû*—*ÎÐÓÆÈÅ ÐÎÑÑÈÈ, Êàòàëîã âîîðóæåíèÿ, âîåííîé è ñïåöèàëüíîé òåõíèêè

I was wondering if anyone else has heard anything on Myanmar's arms purchases, or what they plan to do with all this hardware.
Some "think-tanks" also stress that Myanmar has covert nuclear ambitions at work.

Myanmar doesn't have much of good relations with some of its neighbors: It has maritime dispute with Bangladesh, tense relations with India and border dispute with Thailand.

I don't think Myanmar can ever arm itself against India but Bangladesh's military modernization ambitions may have triggered Myanmar to make purchase of new weapons.
 

STURM

Well-Known Member
I was wondering if anyone else has heard anything on Myanmar's arms purchases, or what they plan to do with all this hardware.
All this new hardware is most probably just part of an ongoing effort to modernise the Myanmar armed forces which despite recent purchases over the years is still counter insurgency orientated and backwards in conventional capababilities compared to most of Myanmmar's neighbours.

The main agenda of the Myanmar government is regime survival and though it has disputes with it's neighbours it's not about to adopt a more assertive or aggressive foreign policy. If however Myanmar starts buying large numbers of jets, artillery, MBTs and MLRS's, etc, then it might indicate something different.
 
Last edited:

funtz

New Member
Every military force needs to upgrade its capability from time to time, and every nation has military needs, especially one with oil and gas interests in the Indian ocean.

Initially there was news of Myanmar going for Mig-29K model, is second hand Mig-29 purchase confirmed?
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #13
Second hand MiG-29 from Russian MoD inventory. At least that's the info I have.

EDIT: If they opted for new builds they'd get the MiG-29M/M2 not the MiG-29K.
 

STURM

Well-Known Member
If one looks at Myanmar's GDP + military budget, its not going to scare any of its neighbours anytime soon...
Very true :p: Plus the fact that the generals main interest is regime survival and making money. Though info on the Myanmar army is scarce I would hazard a guess that it still consists mostly of light infantry units and lack the heavy firepower the Royal Thai Army or even the Bangladesh army has.

I have no doubt however, that like other countries, a number of arms purchases by Myanmar has gone unreported, and it would be no surprise if in the future we find that they have some MANPADS or ATGWs that were previously unreported. Off topic but there was a recent article in Small Arms Review about Myanmar small arms in which mention was made of ex Singapore army M16A1s turning up in Myanmar.
 

funtz

New Member
Second hand MiG-29 from Russian MoD inventory. At least that's the info I have.

EDIT: If they opted for new builds they'd get the MiG-29M/M2 not the MiG-29K.
I had read this news about a purchase
A 400 million-euro ($570 mln) contract has been signed for the delivery of Russian MiG-29 fighters for the Myanmar Air Force, a source close to Russia's arms export monopoly told a business daily on Wednesday.

Vedomosti quoted the source at Rosoboronexport as saying the Russian bid to supply MiG-29 Fulcrum-D carrier-based fighter jets beat China's offer to sell its latest J-10 and FC-1 fighters.
Myanmar to buy 20 MiG-29 fighters for $570 mln - paper | Business | RIA Novosti
 

weasel1962

New Member
Re:

I have no doubt however, that like other countries, a number of arms purchases by Myanmar has gone unreported, and it would be no surprise if in the future we find that they have some MANPADS or ATGWs that were previously unreported. Off topic but there was a recent article in Small Arms Review about Myanmar small arms in which mention was made of ex Singapore army M16A1s turning up in Myanmar.
Not exactly a major issue. Myanmar uses a lot of differing small arms and M-16s aren't exactly state of the art. And even if correct, are probably just a tip of the iceberg and could be private arms smuggling rather than official dealings. There's the EMERK which the chinese helped to set up a manufacturing facility (with rumours of assistance from Israel and SG) which may have confused the issue.

This is what Amnesty states but not exactly concrete evidence.
http://www.amnesty.ca/amnestynews/upload/ASA160142007.pdf

SG involvement may also be more than that.
Myanmar's Chinese Connection --- Asia Pacific Media Service

The main issue is that there's no arms embargo sanctioned by the UN. In SG's case, the controls have been tightened with the Singapore strategic goods control act which is supposed to curb middlemen transactions and transhipments through SG. Controls if one knows what ICA is doing are actually fairly tight now.

Most countries including Malaysia have their fair share of private arms smuggling...
 

STURM

Well-Known Member
Most countries including Malaysia have their fair share of private arms smuggling...
Yes they do..... no doubt. There were reports of Malaysia providing the Bosnians with small arms and artillery, in collaboration with Turkey, during the 90's. Not a major issue of course with the M16s, but I was surprised on why Myanmar would want M16s when it already has tonnes of AKs and other small arms.

After China, Singapore probably has the closest relationship and influence with Myanmar [maybe even more than Thailand] and this is a positive development as it could be a stabilising and decisive factor should tensions arise over any disputes involving Myanmar and its neighbours.

Apart from the Myanmar Air Force article in ACIG, does anyone know of any online sources that cover the Thai/Myanmar border clash a few years ago?
 
Last edited:

Chino

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Found this article in a Chinese forum. Author unknown and facts unverified.







EMEC / MYANMAR HEAVY INDUSTRIES EMERK-3 rifle and MA-1 carbine.








EMEC (The Electro Mechanical and Engineering Corps of the Burmese Armed Forces) are in charge to engineer new weapons. The KA-PA-SA state-owned armaments factory located in Rangoon has acquired from a now defunct italian firearms manufacturer, in 1945, the right to manufacture the TZ45 submachinegun, there known as the BA52. Long before the arms embargo struck Burma, a german engineer, called FRITZ WERNER, established there plants to manufacture G3 battle rifles; after the embargo, the factory was taken over by the military government, who renamed it MYANMAR FRITZ WERNER COMPANY (despite of their names, however, ALL the burmese arms factories are state-owned), where G3 rifles are still produced, and from where come out also G3 rifles converted under project of EMEC to feed from STANAG M16-style magazines and fire the .5'56x45mm-NATO ammunition. It's however known that EMEC has HOWEVER its own production plants, known as MYANMAR HEAVY INDUSTRIES ORGANIZATION. It's also known that countries such as Israel and Singapore often sell illegally firearms manufacturing technology to this country.










A major scandal happened when it was known that a controversial oil duct built in Burma was patrolled by guards armed with a new bull-pup rifle, called EMERK-1 and manufactured by EMEC - MYANMAR HEAVY INDUSTRIES ORGANIZATION. Before this, a chinese company called NG CHUNG-KEUNG, subsidiary of NORINCO, had shipped to Burma under burmese governmental request some exemplars of the new NORINCO QBZ-97 .5'56mm bull-pup assault rifle for evaluation. The burmese trialers were positively impressed by this weapon, but the communist chinese government didn't really wanted to sell firearms to an extreme right-wing dictatorship, and thus the shipment of the new QBZ-97 rifles to Burma were halted and further ones completely canceled.








So the burmese engineers took over the exemplars of QBZ-97 still illegally remaining on the country, and modified the project of the weapon to allow it to be manufactured with some minor modifications with the machineries they had, illegally sold to Burma by Singapore. It's also known that the EMERK-1 is slightly similar to the Steyr AUG, and that israeli IMI engineers who previously had worked to the IMI TAVOR project traveled to Burma to counsel their burmese colleagues; little is known about this EMERK-1 bull-pup rifle, except that it is in the hands of "élite" burmese troops, it's a "melange" of the chinese NORINCO QBZ-97, the singaporean ST-KINETICS SAR-21, the austrian STEYR AUG and the israeli IMI TAVOR, that it's manufactured in both AR and SAW variants and that the burmese troops that have it, especially governmental guards, don't like it because it's prone to jammings and stoppages. Instead, the MAIN weapons system of the Burmese Armed Forces is well-liked by its users. The EMERK-3 Rifle System, as posted in this pic smuggled from Burma, is an illegal copy / updated version of the israeli IMI GALIL assault rifle, manufactured under supervision of israeli consultants and with the use of israeli and singaporean mahineries shipped to Burma in violation of the UN/USA embargo.








The EMERK-3 rifle is nothing but a GALIL rifle with fixed stock. In this picture is also equipped with a BA203 40mm grenade launcher, a slightly modified illegally produced version of the american M203 grenade launcher, which makes JANE'S and FREE BURMA COALITION observers think that machineries to manufacture this launcher were also illegally shipped to Burma from USA companies, but most probably the responsible for this new embargo violation is Singapore, which has obtained the license to manufacture the american M203 to equip with it national-manufactured rifles such as the M16-S1 (singaporean copy of the AR15 assault rifle, now out of production), SAR-80 and SR88 weapons systems and the new SAR-21 bull-pup long firearms cache. When mounted on the EMERK-3 rifle, this M203-lookalike grenade launcher features also a new barrel cover for the rifle, equipped with a grenade peepsight.
[ 转自铁血社区 Ê×Ò³ - ÌúѪÉçÇø - ÌúѪÂÛ̳ - ÌúѪÍø ]








The EMERK-3 RIFLE is appearently identical to the IMI GALIL exception made for some very little external carachteristics, so that the GALIL specifics are assumed to be valid for this rifle too.








The MA-1 CARBINE is a shortened copy of the EMERK-3 rifle, with a folding metal buttstock. The barrel is shorter that the one of the EMERK-3 rifle, and the similarities with the GALIL are much more pronunciated. The MA-1 features a ventilated handguard.








Both the EMERK-1 bull-pup rifle and the MYANMAR FRITZ WERNER COMPANY / EMEC prototype .5'56mm G3 version feed from STANAG M16-Style magazines, while the EMERK-3 rifle and the MA-1 carbine feed from GALIL-style 30-rounders. Other details about the burmese firearms production are scarce. This picture was ripped off from a website which a few days later disappeared from the web (shutdown by the burmese government, maybe?), and the burmese authorities by themselves are prone to use ALL ways to keep their domestic weapons production secret.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #20
I wasn't able to find any sources indicating that Sokol got new MiG-29K orders. I also wasn't able to find any Russian sources confirming the mode type. Your source may simply be a case of presumptuous translation. I strongly suspect that an order that would give Sokol additional production, would receive at least some publicity. Also 572 mil USD is about 28mil per plane. Sounds more like second hand SMT upgrades, then new MiG-29Ks.
 
Top