Marine Nationale (French Navy)

[swerve]

Yes the FREDA are very disappointing.

Agreed. Cancelling the last two Forbins in favour of FREDAs was a purely financial decision, & one I fear the French will come to regret.

The French should put the V L Mica's active seeker on the V L Crotale ,so they can carry a quad packed short range missile, and then they would be able to carry more Aster 30s.

An interesting idea. OF course, Crotale has a much shorter range than Aster 15, or even VL Mica, but I've heard it's reckoned to be good at close range, & against missiles.

 

[StevoJH]

Of course they could always purchase CAMM :flaming

 

[youpii]

If the Horizons are attached to the French AGs then they can probably get away with it. The FREDA could then be attached the French carrier groups were they have supported by the E2Cs in a networked group. If they are assigned are assigned to AGs the French may be in alot of trouble.

MN will have 3 (maybe 4) BPC (french LHD) that have basically no AAW defense.
Having 2 AAW destroyers (out of 4) with crippled radars is a very high operational constraint.

FREDA should have the EMPAR radar like the Horizon and Italian FREMM, and more missiles: find some space for 16 extra Aster 15/30 or buy the Mica VL like the Greek FREMM.

And as the La Fayette are now "1st rank frigates", they should get the 16x Aster 15 that was planned from the beginning or 8x Aster 15 & 8x Mica VL.

 

[Spacearrow99]

Agreed. Cancelling the last two Forbins in favour of FREDAs was a purely financial decision, & one I fear the French will come to regret.


An interesting idea. OF course, Crotale has a much shorter range than Aster 15, or even VL Mica, but I've heard it's reckoned to be good at close range, & against missiles.

MBDA has developed a longer ranged version of Crotale ( Crotale Mk 3). I has maximum range of 16 kms fired in the standard horizontal postion. Ofcourse, ithe V L Crotale would have less range.

 

[kev 99]

I'll go along with everyone else here and say that the FREDA does sound more than a little disappointing, at the very least I would of expected it to have the same EMPAR radar as the Forbins.

 

[harryriedl]

Agreed. Cancelling the last two Forbins in favour of FREDAs was a purely financial decision, & one I fear the French will come to regret.


An interesting idea. OF course, Crotale has a much shorter range than Aster 15, or even VL Mica, but I've heard it's reckoned to be good at close range, & against missiles.[/QUOTE


MBDA has developed a longer ranged version of Crotale ( Crotale Mk 3). I has maximum range of 16 kms fired in the standard horizontal postion. Ofcourse, ithe V L Crotale would have less range.

If it has that range why not just stick with VL Mica

 

[Spacearrow99]

If it has that range why not just stick with VL Mica

Well I want the DGA to put the Mica's active seeker on the Crotale; the Crotale can be quad packed. The Mica cannot be quad packed. This arrangement would only the FREDA, and i would add the 8 A43 launchers, on leftside of FREMM Fheliocopter hanger. That woud give the FREDA capabilitiy to carry atleast 32 Aster 30 and up 96 VL Crotale.

 

[swerve]

Well I want the DGA to put the Mica's active seeker on the Crotale; the Crotale can be quad packed. The Mica cannot be quad packed. This arrangement would only the FREDA, and i would add the 8 A43 launchers, on leftside of FREMM Fheliocopter hanger. That woud give the FREDA capabilitiy to carry atleast 32 Aster 30 and up 96 VL Crotale.

A43? If you want them for VL Crotale, why not fit A35, & save a bit of money & weight? A43 can take Aster 15 (but not 30), & are bigger than you need for Crotale.

 

[Spacearrow99]

A43? If you want them for VL Crotale, why not fit A35, & save a bit of money & weight? A43 can take Aster 15 (but not 30), & are bigger than you need for Crotale.

I ment to say A35 launchers. Well, the DGA has made some very bad decisions over the years. Not building a second carrier right after the CDG, not upgrading the Lafayettes, and the FREDA in its current configuration.

 

[murene]

The MN could continued with construcion of third and fourth frigates AAW Horizon. If it had been reduced the number of SSN Suffren of 6 to 5 and the exchange the two FREDAs by the Horizon to have saved the sufficient money for the second pair of Horizon.

1,3 billion € -1SSN Suffren
1,2 billion € -2 FREDAs
-----------------
2,5 billion € for 2 Horizon AAW

With four operative AAW Horizon could to extend itself the number of VLS from 48 to 64 to mount 16 launchers Slylver A-70 for Scalp Naval missiles or to change them in the future by Aster 30 block 2 to provide cover ATBM with the S-1850 radar, doing these ships much more versatile and multipurpose ships.

and the fleet of MN in the future;
4 SSBN "Le triomphant"
5 SSN "Suffren"
1CVN "CdG"
3 LHD "BPC"
2 TCD "Foudre"
4 AAW Horizon
9 FREMM
5 Lafayette
6 Floreal

 

[Spacearrow99]

The MN could continued with construcion of third and fourth frigates AAW Horizon. If it had been reduced the number of SSN Suffren of 6 to 5 and the exchange the two FREDAs by the Horizon to have saved the sufficient money for the second pair of Horizon.

1,3 billion € -1SSN Suffren
1,2 billion € -2 FREDAs
-----------------
2,5 billion € for 2 Horizon AAW

With four operative AAW Horizon could to extend itself the number of VLS from 48 to 64 to mount 16 launchers Slylver A-70 for Scalp Naval missiles or to change them in the future by Aster 30 block 2 to provide cover ATBM with the S-1850 radar, doing these ships much more versatile and multipurpose ships.

and the fleet of MN in the future;
4 SSBN "Le triomphant"
5 SSN "Suffren"
1CVN "CdG"
3 LHD "BPC"
2 TCD "Foudre"
4 AAW Horizon
9 FREMM
5 Lafayette
6 Floreal

The MN future fleet will look somthing like this

1 or 2 CVN
6 SSN
4 LHD
2 AAW Horizon
5 Lafayette
6 Floreal

The MN havinf conversations about starting withdrawning the Lafayettes in 2020. Well, the next white paper should designate thee A69 replacemnt. And the one after that should give us the atleast the Floreal replace.

 

[FluffyThoughts]

The MN future fleet will look somthing like this

1 or 2 CVN
6 SSN
4 LHD
2 AAW Horizon
5 Lafayette
6 Floreal

The MN havinf conversations about starting withdrawning the Lafayettes in 2020. Well, the next white paper should designate thee A69 replacemnt. And the one after that should give us the atleast the Floreal replace.

Can't see the FREMM project being scrapped. :crazy

 

[swerve]

Can't see the FREMM project being scrapped. :crazy

No, not with 11 ordered, & at least two building.

 

[youpii]

The MN future fleet will look somthing like this

1 or 2 CVN
6 SSN
4 LHD
2 AAW Horizon
5 Lafayette
6 Floreal

The MN havinf conversations about starting withdrawning the Lafayettes in 2020. Well, the next white paper should designate thee A69 replacemnt. And the one after that should give us the atleast the Floreal replace.

Let's say:
1 or 2 CVN
4 SSBN
6 SSN
4 LHD
2 AAW Horizon
2 AAW FREDA
9 ASW FREMM
5 Lafayette
6 OPV Floreal
9 OPV GoWind

I don't know how to define Lafayette, neither AAW nor ASW...

 

[harryriedl]

Let's say:
1 or 2 CVN
4 SSBN
6 SSN
4 LHD
2 AAW Horizon
2 AAW FREDA
9 ASW FREMM
5 Lafayette
6 OPV Floreal
9 OPV GoWind

I don't know how to define Lafayette, neither AAW nor ASW...

I thought PA-2 or CdG-Julliet is a very dead program. so whats the likelihood of a new CV/CVN program

 

[youpii]

I thought PA-2 or CdG-Julliet is a very dead program. so whats the likelihood of a new CV/CVN program

French shipyards need jobs ...

 

[kev 99]

Cheaper to build Mistrals and flog them to Russia/whoever.

 

[youpii]

Cheaper to build Mistrals and flog them to Russia/whoever.

I think France will only build one for the Russians, the other ones would be build in Russia.

 

[Spacearrow99]

The MN future fleet will look somthing like this

1 or 2 CVN
6 SSN
4 LHD
2 AAW Horizon
5 Lafayette
6 Floreal

The MN havinf conversations about starting withdrawning the Lafayettes in 2020. Well, the next white paper should designate thee A69 replacemnt. And the one after that should give us the atleast the Floreal replace.

I forgot to add the FREDA and 9 FREMM to my list. STX France is really low on work, so the PA2 will get ordered.

 

[riksavage]

I forgot to add the FREDA and 9 FREMM to my list. STX France is really low on work, so the PA2 will get ordered.

How can the French justify only two dedicated AEW? Forget building a second carrier, they need a better theatre defence capability to defend the ships they already have.