Iranian 12.7 mm anti Material Sniper Goes under Production

[norinco89]

Iran has begun to produce heavy machine-guns with armor-piercing bullets, Iranian state television reported today. Iranian Defence Minister Ali Shamkhani said the 12.7-millimeter gun has a range of 2.5 kilometers and is suitable for snipers.


R they refering to another gun? I am confused.

750 rounds is a little too much for a heavy machine gun.

browning can only achieve like 550

750 is more for light machine guys

So Are they refering to anti material sniper rifle or a heavy machine gun

 

[chrisstevenson]

Thanks aaaditya,

I own the original Fortmeir 50cal (the one that Steyr took over production of) pics at www.50cal.co.uk . Really just wondering what scope system the Iranians are planning to use and what ammunition etc.

norinco89, there is a Swiss company making a 50cal maching gun, quite light weight but with a ROF in excess of 900 rpm, it uses M13 type links, not the regular 50cal links so the bolt operates more like an MG42. I guess that unless its bolted down it might be a little tricky to actually hit anything!

All this talk of a 50cal round hitting the same point on an armored target is so funny, you guys should try it one day, if you hit the same square metre at 1 mile then you're doing pretty well!

 

[aaaditya]

Iran has begun to produce heavy machine-guns with armor-piercing bullets, Iranian state television reported today. Iranian Defence Minister Ali Shamkhani said the 12.7-millimeter gun has a range of 2.5 kilometers and is suitable for snipers.


R they refering to another gun? I am confused.

750 rounds is a little too much for a heavy machine gun.

browning can only achieve like 550

750 is more for light machine guys

So Are they refering to anti material sniper rifle or a heavy machine gun

well the defence minister has clearly mentioned that the guns is suitable as a sniper rifle ,so i dont think it can be a machine guns,since the machine guns are too inaccurate to be used as snipers because of their high rate of fire.

 

[gf0012-aust]

so i dont think it can be a machine guns,since the machine guns are too inaccurate to be used as snipers because of their high rate of fire.

thats not entirely true - as a secondary role some can be used on select fire.

 

[Soner1980]

Iran is able to produce a weapon for the infantry. It is the same sniper rifle what the US, Turkey, and other nations use in their sniper teams. The Barrett M82A1. This gun weights like a light machine gun and is able to hit target up to 1800 meters or maybe 2500 meter. It differs for the type of the round used. Turkey also produces a 'look-a-like' Barrett M82A1 it is not hard to produce such weapons. Turkey had needed some 8 month to get in full production. Why the others are unable to produce? Iran has their facilities for such weapons. Knock off or not, they produce their own weapons.

 

[norinco89]

Other countries honor copyright laws. bloody pirate!

 

[Soner1980]

It is not a nock-off, but a 50 cal sniper rifle that already exist is maybe used for reverse engineering. And then Iran has developed their own gun with the information gained with the existing one. Nobody can proof of piracy.

 

[jamesteo320]

does anybody knows which is the best sniper rifle of 12.7 mm ammo for russian army and special forces?

 

[Jkim890]

Any big bore .50 cal rifle is capable of taking out even something like the M1A2 Abrams. You just gotta know how to use it (i/e anti-material snipers are trained in this). And with APC's, it's even easier.

 

[Manfred]

Any big bore .50 cal rifle is capable of taking out even something like the M1A2 Abrams. You just gotta know how to use it (i/e anti-material snipers are trained in this). And with APC's, it's even easier.

You gotta be kidding me.

"take out" an M1a2 with as 50 cal? No, I don't think so. In 1945, the Russians discovered that their 14.5mm rifles could not pop the treads on a Tiger 2 for a mobility kill. The M1 is just as heavy, and presumably have treads that are at least as strong.

Vision blocks are easly replaced from within the vehicle. The M1 is not totaly depandant on the sights in the doghouse, either.

And yes, I know about the battery box, but you have to be above and behind the tank to get a shot at it. Unless you are (temporarily) lucky in an urban environment, you would have to be in a helecopter to get that angle.

 

[extern]

...I know about the battery box, but you have to be above and behind the tank to get a shot at it. Unless you are (temporarily) lucky in an urban environment, you would have to be in a helecopter to get that angle.

Not only... If you hit here, the MG will be disabled because fume going into the apartment:

 

[Chrom]

You gotta be kidding me.

"take out" an M1a2 with as 50 cal? No, I don't think so. In 1945, the Russians discovered that their 14.5mm rifles could not pop the treads on a Tiger 2 for a mobility kill. The M1 is just as heavy, and presumably have treads that are at least as strong.

Vision blocks are easly replaced from within the vehicle. The M1 is not totaly depandant on the sights in the doghouse, either.

And yes, I know about the battery box, but you have to be above and behind the tank to get a shot at it. Unless you are (temporarily) lucky in an urban environment, you would have to be in a helecopter to get that angle.

Ya, seriosly, i wouldnt try .50 cal on ANY tank, let alone M1A2. Much too high risk for alsmost no chances. I think you can damage main gun and optic with lucky hit, but the hit must be indeed LUCKY. It is very hard to hit such small area as optic even on stationary target.

As for Iran... 0.50 cal sniper rifle is not that high-tech equipment, basically 70-years old Browning technology already will be good enouth . Any decent 3rd-world country can produce it given enouth will and money. Another qestion, it is almost certainly cheaper to buy these rifles from more experienced manufacturer... but self-sufficiency is priceless.

 

[gf0012-aust]

Not only... If you hit here, the MG will be disabled because fume going into the apartment:

I was under the distinct impression that the battery box on the M1 is quarantined - as are the rounds etc.....

 

[Waylander]

Disabled is maybe the wrong word. Leave the hatches open and you can still fire some 120mm without the crew compartment being too smoky.
Enough to welcome the friendly .50cal sniper with some MPATs if he is spotted which is for sure a possibility with two TIs and accompanying tanks and mech inf.

This is the problem when attacking tanks. You should be sure to really hurt and confuse them. Everything halfhearted will likely result in your own death.

 

[Jkim890]

Tanks have this aura around them of being immune to bullets, and for good reason. However...

Do you guys see all the high tech things that are on the outside of a modern tank? Anywhere you spot glass is likely to be destroyed by a .50 cal sniper from 300-800 meters away.

Plenty of opportunities where you can find one of these babies rolling along at 5-10mph on a road, making it an easy shot. Or you can even create one (the ole, have one of your guys pull up a car in front of the tank and yell at it to watch their driving, etc.).

I mean, sure. They got bulletproof shields on those things, but only when they're not in use. Drive with that slab of steel covering your optical gun sights and you might as well shoot them yourself.

And last but not least (this should have been obvious), one of the crew could be poking their heads out of the top. My trigger finger's itchin.

And this don't even apply to tanks either. Say you got a jet fighter sitting on a runway, ready for takeoff. Send one bullet through the nose cone, bam. No more radar. A 5 dollar bullet destroying over 2 million dollars worth of equipment? Not to mention disabling a plane that costs 7 times as much.

Basically, the real goal of these kinds of snipers is to cause chaos and mayhem. Much more than can be provided by one guy.

 

[Waylander]

For sure anti-material snipers have their roles and can be very effective.
But one also have to consider that there are often much better targets for 12.7mm weapons than tanks.
Just because normally (There are exceptions as with everything else and you can be lucky to have a good opportunity but you should not take it as given) tanks are not alone, they have replacements for their periscopes, auxiliary sights (Not vulnerable to 12.7mm weapons) and independent hunter/killer capabilities with TIs.
Attacking well trained tank units with 12.7mm rifles is a risky operation.

Lets take a tank platoon on a thunder run or on a patrol as an example. You for sure get your first shot at a sight or at an exposed crewman. But after your shot several TIs go hunting and with 120mm ammo you don't need to be very accurate to get your sniper killed.
IEDs/Mines, ATGMs and modern RPGs are IMHO the better choice for attacking tanks.
Save your trained snipers for other targets. They are an important asset and the risks of attacking tank units (Beside some lonely opportunity shozs) is high.

 

[extern]

For sure anti-material snipers have their roles and can be very effective.
Lets take a tank platoon on a thunder run or on a patrol as an example. You for sure get your first shot at a sight or at an exposed crewman. But after your shot several TIs go hunting and with 120mm ammo you don't need to be very accurate to get your sniper killed.
IEDs/Mines, ATGMs and modern RPGs are IMHO the better choice for attacking tanks.
Save your trained snipers for other targets.

Exactly said! THere is MUCH more safe to be inside the tank that out, when snipers are around. You can see as well the bloody work of Iraqis snipers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2BuzEc6Dns&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dk3ZmlaOnU&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCe2SbzFCHs&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSyoLLRqSJ8&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9vQYDoJ3vk&mode=related&search=

 

[Manfred]

I would use AMGs (Anti Material Guns) to back-up the ATGMs. Anything that is not a tank is vulnerable to these guns, and that covers the vast majority of vehicles deployed.

Yes, the battery box is outside the crew compartment, so fumes are not an issue. The problem is you cannot re-start the M1 without batteries, and those things drink a LOT of fuel.

 

[Waylander]

You cannot restart them without the APU? This is not right. The APU just fullfills what a APU should do and this is generating power when the engine is off without exhausting the normal batteries.

 

[Manfred]

Ive spoken to the crews, and they have to run the engine when they are on overwatch, to keep the sights on and the turret moving. Things might have changed in 15 years, but I havent heard things changed on that score.