Indonesian Aero News

[Sandhi Yudha]

Indonésie : Client du Rafale, l'Indonésie se tourne vers la Chine pour acquérir d'autres avions de chasse

Selon nos informations, l'armée de l'air indonésienne a donné son accord de principe pour acheter 42 avions de chasse J-10 à la Chine. Si le contrat devenait ferme et définitif, ils voleraient aux

www.intelligenceonline.fr

42 seems the magic number. 42 Rafale now negotiating for 42 J-10C. 24 F-15ID still also in negotiation. However if 42 now become the magic number, why don't also take 42 F-16V.

42 Rafale, 42 J-10C, 42 F-16V or 24 F-15ID. Because, why not. If India only have Rafale and Pakistan only have J-10C, why don't emulate Egypt and have both in inventory. Because, why not.

Meteor, PL-15 and AIM-120, because again why not.

Add: Some rumours talk the budget allocation for that J-10C, are coming from allocation that supposedly goes to KF-21 procurement.

The ex-Qatari Mirage 2000-5s are definitive canceled, right?
Or do they plan for a mixed of
42 Rafale + 24 Mirage 2000-5
42 F-16 + 24 F-15EX
42 T-50i + 24 Su-27/-30
42 JF-17 + 24 J-10C ?

TNI-AU fleet strategy.

An airforce specially created for airshows with a unique mixed fleet of unique models... all unarmed of course.... and only flying twice a year.

 

[Ananda]

Macron now in Indonesia, so let's see the result. Got feeling in the end Frenchie, Turkiye and Italia will get biggest portion, while some US and China procurement will happen for balancing Geopolitics and Investment nature.

Macron ke RI, Indonesia-Perancis Bakal Jalin Kerja Sama Pembelian Pesawat Tempur-Kapal Selam

Menteri Pertahanan Indonesia dan Perancis siap tanda tangani kerja sama pertahanan alutsista strategis. Kunjungan Macron jadi momentum penting.

nasional.kompas.com

Minister of Defence allready stated there will br signing agreement on 'strategic' systems with Frenchie during Macron visit. Potentially to launch Scorpene program is one of the loudest rumours. Additional Rafale is being talk for some time before.

ex-Qatari Mirage 2000-5s are definitive canceled, right?

Well it is part of rumours that I also heard. The money for 12 Qatar Mirage 2000-5 will be use to add at least 6 Rafale and to make 16 per squadrorn of 3, instead present number of 14 per Sq. However some also say the Qatar Mirage project still on going. Still the 1st batch budget of 6 using Su-35 money, and who knows there will be 4th batch of 6 using Mirage 2000-5 money.

For me, back to money trail availability again. Indonesia don't have unlimited budget. Hopefully F-15EX that give, and procure AW&C and Helicopters instead. Right now, the lobby is intensified, that's why this all conflicting rumours. In the end there are always budget reality.

 

[Ananda]

https://x.com/SebLecornu/status/1927644927514579291?s=09

L’Indonésie confirme sa confiance dans l’excellence de l’industrie de défense française !


À l’occasion de la visite d’État d’@EmmanuelMacron, signature avec mon homologue d’une lettre d’intention portant sur l’acquisition future :


de Rafale supplémentaires à @Dassault_OnAir


de frégates légères et sous-marins Scorpène supplémentaires à @navalgroup


de canons CAESAR supplémentaires et leurs munitions à @KNDS_France

Well it is still Letter of Intent on:

1. Adittional Rafale,
2. Adittional Caesar SPG,
3. Adiitional Scorpene and Light Frigate.

So all additional of existing order, which bring to talk on Light Frigate. There's no existing contract of NG Light Frigate. Some in here talk on FDI, but is FDI on Light Frigate category in Naval Group ? As Light Frigate seems also refer by NG on their larger Gowind design, like Gowind 3100 that become Malaysian LCS.

So it is still intention, and in Indonesia means longer term. It is more politically show case, and potentially will not happen in this term. So unles Prabowo win second term, it is in my suspicion more or less stay as intention. This term Frenchie seems more getting what already under contract like 42 Rafale and hopefully building of 2 Scorpene.

 

[Ananda]

Few Hours ago Defense Minister Sjafrie on-line accounts put this. Seems after that being taken out then rerelease without any mentioning of J-10. This is the post on his meeting with Indonesian Ambassador in Beijing.

Well, even the Defense Minister staff already remove mention on J-10, but some of local medias already taking that, and put it in their article. Something that should be a lesson on any Staff that handle his bos social media account. Once being put, already been seen.

https://www.tribunnews.com/nasional/2025/05/30/menhan-dan-dubes-ri-untuk-rrt-bahas-rencana-pelatihan-pilot-tni-au-terkait-pesawat-tempur-j-10

https://www.jawapos.com/nasional/016079728/bertemu-dubes-indonesia-untuk-tiongkok-menhan-sjafrie-sjamsoeddin-bahas-pelatihan-pesawat-tempur-j-10-untuk-pilot-tni-au

There are also conflicting rumours on which version of J-10 being talk with China. The rumours that circulate:

1. It is brand new J-10C,
2. Second hand J-10A/B
3. Second hand AL-31 engine J-10C.

Rumours being rumours, but for me (as seems J-10 increasingly become real deals anyway), hopefully it will be #3. Seems some planners think, well since Rafale and J-10C now already "battle proven", let's have them both. Some talks say those AL-31 engined J-10C are being push asside as PLAF want to focus J-10C with their own WS-10 engine. So they are willing to give them on cheap prices, and TNI-AU already more familiar with AL-31.

Will this means Mirage 2000-5/9 ex Qatar or UAE Will also join? As more Rafale coming, thus more Frenchie logistics ? Well why not, the more the merrier. Get those Mirage 2K, get more Flankers, get more Chinese J-10C. Let's make everyone happy. Afterall Indonesian politics is to make everyone involve in the deals.

In the end the goal keeper are finance guys that decided which one from those deals that can be afforded and become effective contracts.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

It took many, many years of negotiations until the definitive contract was signed for the Rafale. It would be weird if the acquisition of the J-10 (second hand or new) is suddenly be done in an instant, only because of the India-Pakistan conflict.

 

[x100 XKR]

It took many, many years of negotiations until the definitive contract was signed for the Rafale. It would be weird if the acquisition of the J-10 (second hand or new) is suddenly be done in an instant, only because of the India-Pakistan conflict.

After the dud C705 missiles, the malfunctioning Giant Bow cannon and the TD2000 Vshorad, I am still amazed that the current administration still exploring Chinese made hardware .......

 

[koxinga]

We will likely get more clarity and details in Indo Defense Expo mid June.

 

[Ananda]

Yes, 11-14 June there will be more clearance on what deals will be signed on. Still this year Indo Defence (officialy still call Indo Defence 2024 as this supposedly biannual events), will not guarantee all what signed will become effective contracts. However as previous IndoDefence shown, mostly will.

As J-10, just like Flankers is not be TNI-AU choices, but more political choices from administration. However if the talk on interim fighters still being put by MinDef, then 2nd hand J-10 with AL-31 engine is relatively better then choices of Chinese Ships and Submarines. This as political demand for Russian and Chinese defense items seems still have strong political lobby.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

After the dud C705 missiles, the malfunctioning Giant Bow cannon and the TD2000 Vshorad, I am still amazed that the current administration still exploring Chinese made hardware .......

I never have heard about malfunctionings or other bad things of the QW-3 / QW-19 MANPADS of the airforce. I wonder how good they are.

Yes, 11-14 June there will be more clearance on what deals will be signed on. Still this year Indo Defence (officialy still call Indo Defence 2024 as this supposedly biannual events), will not guarantee all what signed will become effective contracts. However as previous IndoDefence shown, mostly will.

As J-10, just like Flankers is not be TNI-AU choices, but more political choices from administration. However if the talk on interim fighters still being put by MinDef, then 2nd hand J-10 with AL-31 engine is relatively better then choices of Chinese Ships and Submarines. This as political demand for Russian and Chinese defense items seems still have strong political lobby.

Well, in that case it can be a good deal if Indonesia buy those second hands J-10 with AL-31 engines, just as a cheap source for AL-31 spare parts.

 

[Ananda]

Indonesia buy those second hands J-10 with AL-31 engines, just as a cheap source for AL-31 spare parts.

Got this from open source that being circulate online. According to source it is base on Airplane Spotters, Information on upgrade and maintenance and those who haven't been spotted flying for more than a month. They claim this possition by end of this month.

Perhaps not all accurate but seems the not flying condition of the Flankers are also being comfirmed by those enthusiats that live close to Hasanuddin AB in Makasar. This shown close to 60% readiness for F-16, while only around 20% for the Flankers.

I have heard for J-10 lobby for sometime. From what I heard it is also connected to deal on helping TNI-AU Flankers readiness. TNI-AU Mk2 from my understanding shares similarities with PLAF Mk2. So if the deal is also for PLAF inventories of AL-31 and also AL-31 engineed J-10B and Early C, then perhaps it is has some ground for non Western sources interim fighters.

Politically some Indonesian factions have continue demand sourcing Fighters from Western and Non Western sources. Despite the talk from Russian Ambasaddor Menhan Sjafrie Terima Sekretaris Dewan Keamanan Rusia, Bahas Pembelian Sukhoi SU-35? on Su-35 contract still not yet cancelled, and there're talks to bring it back. However the question now is the reliability of Russian Supply Chain. For that after see some rumours and potential China deals, and TNI-AU Flankers readiness, I do suspect China supply chain being bring in to augment Belarusia supply chains (that used unofficialy from what I heard as Rosoboron agents too).

The lists of TNI-AU fast jets also shown deteriorating readiness from Hawk 200/100 while readiness for TA-50 is around similar ball park with F-16. In sense this is make some sense, why most exercise that involve fast jets, mostly use F-16, TA-50, then Hawk 200. Hawk 200 is being prepare to be replace by Rafale. If the situation readiness on those Flankers not improving, perhaps those J-10 being source as Flankers replacement.

The F-16 C/D are slotted to upgrade using TAI Ozgur program. This is also why Mirage 2000-5 ex Qatar still being consider. Some say as stop gap while F-16 C/D being upgrade to Ozgur standard. Either way, this is just shown why TNI-AU love their F-16, and why personally I'm still hoping they ditch F-15EX and get 32-48 F-16V instead 24 F-15EX/ID.