indian small arms thread .

[aaaditya]

hey guys india nad germany have signed the defence cooperation agreement,is there any chance for the indian ordinance factories board to acquire german small arms technology?

here check out this link:

http://www.outlookindia.com/pti_news.asp?gid=73

Paving the way for bilateral strategic and security cooperation, India and Germany have signed their first-ever defence pact encompassing joint training, technology transfers and co-production of hi-tech military hardware.

The Indo-German Defence Cooperation agreement, which would help New Delhi broadbase its military equipment suppliers to make arms purchases more competitive, was signed late last night here by Defence Minister Pranab Mukherjee and his German Counterpart Franz Josef Jung.

Though both the leaders refused to elaborate what areas of defence the agreement was aimed at, Jung said it would mostly cover exchange of cooperation in the field of Navy and in electronic and sureviellance systems, in which Germany recently had made big breakthroughs.

German defence industries are keen on participating in major Indian defence projects as they feel Berlin is being left out in the race for Indian defence markets by countries like France and Britain.

Germany is also keen to tap Indian expertise in counter terrorism operations, as recently the German army is being deployed overseas in such operations.

Answering a volley of queries from newsmen after the signing of the pact, Mukherjee said the agreement, which comes into force immediately, provides for setting up of a high defence committee which would work out the areas of cooperation between the two countries.

 

[parm]

You are talking BS. The Army just placed another huge order for INSAS, ask any guy in procurement if you know any.

The Aks were inducted for three reasons:
1. Ammo for INSAS was unavailable, delaying its induction in units a few years back, till the ammo plants started churning out ammo
2. In COIN, troops prefer volume of fire, which Ak has (auto mode, vs Insas's 3 round burst)
3. Ammo is not a concern in COIN (ready lines of supply), nor is accuracy- most of the engagements occur at CQB scenarios (close quarter battle).

For the above, Aks are present in COIN dedicated units- Rashtriya rifles and the like. The other units tasked with regular ops, all use INSAS.

1.well if INSAS cant perform in COIN, why was it made in the first place and inducted into IA? i think they forgot india has insurgency!!
2.if INSAS is home made, did they forget to make ammo for it?
3. why have two or three different kinds of guns in the IA as there can be wrong ammo goin to wrong units in time of a war?

why NATO standardised there ammo? i guess now u know!

looks like indian ordinance factories work with absent minded peaple, after all its a GOVT department!!
looks like ministers or top officials sitting in higher posts dont care about the IA jawan putting his life on risk for his country and all they come up with is a remix version of AK, GALIL and FAL to make INSAS!!!

 

[Archer]

1.well if INSAS cant perform in COIN, why was it made in the first place and inducted into IA? i think they forgot india has insurgency!!

It was made for the Indian Armys GQSR for a BATTLE RIFLE. Which insisted on a 3 round mode for ammunition conservation. During trials at Mhow, and based upon their experience in Sri Lanka, the IA determined that a rifle at full auto was practically f**k all in terms of accuracy, and soldiers would often squeeze off entire mags without realizing it. However in COIN ammunition resupply is NOT a problem, nor is accuracy (beyond 150 mtrs) an issue. Most engagements occur at relatively close range where the inaccuracy of the Ak does not matter, or for that matter its weight (ammo & multiple mags).

2.if INSAS is home made, did they forget to make ammo for it?

Do you have a problem reading? The Ammunition factory didnt come from the sky. It had to be set up, the production had to be tested for consistency. In the meanwhile, the IA imported Aks.

3. why have two or three different kinds of guns in the IA as there can be wrong ammo goin to wrong units in time of a war?

Again, the INSAS is the battle rifle. And the IA has well earmarked lines of ammunition for supply and deployment. They deal with this on a daily basis.

why NATO standardised there ammo? i guess now u know!

Without you, the IA would not have known anything! Thank the Almighty!

looks like indian ordinance factories work with absent minded peaple, after all its a GOVT department!!
looks like ministers or top officials sitting in higher posts dont care about the IA jawan putting his life on risk for his country and all they come up with is a remix version of AK, GALIL and FAL to make INSAS!!!

Do you actually have any sense or just like to talk rubbish for the heck of it? Perhaps you are going through the "lets rant for rantings sake" phase! How many rifles have you designed btw?

 

[aaaditya]

also it was the first time that indian army was using the 5.56 caliber ,it used the 7.62 earlier.the production technology was acquired from belgium for the nato standard ss109 rounds,for the earlier insas guns(used during the kargil war for trials) the ammo was imported from belgium,once the production facilities were set up there was no problem in acquiring these rounds or the guns.