Dehli Class vs Sovernmey

[dabrownguy]

It didn't say 52c or whatever can take a delhi class i was pointing out that with out proper statistics we can't on paper prove which is superior.

 

[gf0012-aust]

Well , Gary , launching a Prithiv missile is different then launching other Antiship missile. Prithiv is not put into the container like launcher and put it on the front deck of the ship ,

It will going to have land like launching system, which will be in back of the ship and once launched , the launcger will be reloaded .

I hope you seen the launcher in land missiles , same case here in prithiv , Its is not to be in ready mode always as it is only to be used for launching land based targets only , not for targeting ship.

You can see testing of Prithiv in ships , in that link
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/MISSILES/Prithvi.html

I am actually quite familiar with Privthi and I stand by what I am saying. Privthi is a LFR which means that it is a volatile system. It's also volatile because such systems have numerous umbilicals and connectors attached externally when they are used in ground launch modes. Any such launching system used at sea would suffer from high corrosion levels and that is something that you do not want to have in an LFR. It will destabilise the system and you risk blowing up the ship.

It is why every other system is designed around an AUR cannister. It's also the reason why the Russians (who have the most Tactical Battlefield Rocket exp in the world) build their TBR systems around solid boosters.

I would not want to be any ship commander on a surface ship using an LFR. Especially if you were under attack, I'd be ditching those rockets overboard faster than a schoolteacher saying "good morning class"

LFR's are the most dangerous, the most volatile and the hardest to logistically deal with out of all ballistics. The other reason why LFR's lost popularity is that it's too easy for a satellite sensing system to identify when they are being armed up for a strike - they are not immediate launch platforms due to the nature of their propellant - and you can't drive around with them sloshing around inside the weapon - especially on a boat rocking at sea. It would be a floating bomb.

Look at a technical precis' on SLBM's for some background information and you'll start to understand what I'm talking about.

The Privthi is an excellent SRBM as a tactical battlefield weapon - that does not make it an ideal weapon system to be used at sea for all of the above reasons (and more which I can't really go into).

Find some technical reasons and I'm quite happy to give you my view of why they are less than satisfactory - and why other systems are more appropriate to use, but I can't help but think that this is an exercise in marketing and justification to the Exchequer/GAO than a real tactical decision.

 

[dabrownguy]

Any chance of it being used on a submarine gf?

 

[gf0012-aust]

Any chance of it being used on a submarine gf?

Only if it's in dry dock and the shipyard gets hit It's a theatre weapon, so it doesn't have the same degree of accuracy as a missile designed for precision targetting.

It would make one hell of a mess of a sub if it ever managed to hit it on the surface though.

 

[Sq No.15]

Any chance of it being used on a submarine gf?

Only if it's in dry dock and the shipyard gets hit It's a theatre weapon, so it doesn't have the same degree of accuracy as a missile designed for precision targetting.

It would make one hell of a mess of a sub if it ever managed to hit it on the surface though.

Well Gary you are missing something here, You talking like conducting air araid with Airbus / Boing.

Prithiv missile is supposed to carry nuke warhead when it put on subs, and accuracy didn't matter in nuke missle, becasue if it hit 100 m away then also it creat the same distruction

India Tests Underwater-Launched Missile:
The missile is also said to have the capability to be launched from a submarine. Today’s launch reportedly took place from a specially constructed underwater platform and canister, from the Integrated Test Range at Chandipur, in the eastern coast state of Orissa

http://missilethreat.com/news/20041027072900.html

 

[gf0012-aust]

Well Gary you are missing something here, You talking like conducting air araid with Airbus / Boing.

What in blazes are you talking about?? :help

Prithiv missile is supposed to carry nuke warhead when it put on subs, and accuracy didn't matter in nuke missle, becasue if it hit 100 m away then also it creat the same distruction

India Tests Underwater-Launched Missile:
The missile is also said to have the capability to be launched from a submarine. Today’s launch reportedly took place from a specially constructed underwater platform and canister, from the Integrated Test Range at Chandipur, in the eastern coast state of Orissa

http://missilethreat.com/news/20041027072900.html

ok, well perhaps you should stop sending me PM's asking technical questions, and then posting responses as though you know the answers.

If you read the link you've quoted, it actually reinforces everything I've been saying about launch cannisters and sea launches. Now you either haven't understood what I've said in the PM's and on here, or you are being mischeivous?? which is it??

As for sending a ballistic nuke to attack a sub, then I am now sure that you don't understand the complexity of the task you've given it. It aint that easy jack. This isn't the movies, it's not hollywoord, it's not bollywood, hell, it isn't even 007. You don't use tactical SLBMs to take out a sub.

Contrary to what you think, a nukes area of effect is determined by yield - and yield is critical in determining CEP - and thus the area of likely destruction. You cannot guide a ballistic weapon with any degree of accuracy onto a moving target. At 25,000kph, tell me how do you intend to guide it? and at what point? once it hits the top of the delivery curve it is almost impossible to shift - you cannot retarget it - you cannot dial in shifting co-ordinates onto a moving target.

and its spelt Prithvi

If you want to have a technical discussion at least get some of the basics right. So far you don't appear to have read and understood anything I've said both here and in the PM's.

 

[Sq No.15]

Well Gary , i think Indian planners also knows that , and they have counter that measure , from unspecified sources , Prithiv missle also tested with soild enignes.

Well i think Indian also taken care of that thing when they decided to put in sea , as far as i know , Liquid missile easy to guide and control during the flith path.

 

[gf0012-aust]

Well Gary , i think Indian planners also knows that , and they have counter that measure , from unspecified sources , Prithiv missle also tested with soild enignes.

Yes, I know that. and a countermeasure to what??

Well i think Indian also taken care of that thing when they decided to put in sea , as far as i know ,

A few threads ago I was trying to explain the issues of AUR cannisters and you didn't get it - now you do??? what gives??

Liquid missile easy to guide and control during the flith path.

It's a ballistic missile - it's not a cruise missile. you just can't tell it to go from "waypoint A" to "waypoint B" as though it's a taxi.

Give me some technical sources about how and where it's been achieved and you'll be "the richest man in babylon". I'll give you a hint - the Russians are probably the best in the world at this - and they can't do it. They've guided tactical battlefield rockets onto a parked car in a town at a 150km range - but they had to dial up the co-ordinates using GPS - you cannot add that capability to a ballistic, you cannot change them mid course on a moving target. They did that with a solid fuel rocket - you cannot do a 10 minute co-ordinate change on a liquid fuel rocket unless its already "live" and ready to go. That's one reason why liquid fuel rockets are unpopular as sub launched weapons. Werner Von Braun discovered that 50 years ago, as did the russians when they sank one of their own subs on a launch. LFR's are inherently unstable - and nobody wants volatile liquid rocket fuel loose in a sub if the cannisters are compromised.

So, what you are saying is Walt Disney stuff. It doesn't happen in the real world for very good reasons.

Tell you what provide me any sources and I'll check them out with people I know who used to work in DRDO. That kind of capability does not stay hidden - and anyone who can do it will be singing like a canary trying to get International Recognition and a gong for achievement.

A little hint. a liquid fueled rocket takes a minimum of 4 times longer to prep for a launch - and every satellite known to mankind tasked with sniffing for nukes will pick up the activity - thats why they are a poor tactical weapon. Solid fuels can be sent to target immediately, they can be re-targetted in under 10 minutes etc etc... LFR's cannot.