Class of Air Warfare Destroyers for Aus

Meh sounds like a good idea but when NZ was squabling for a third frigate the Aus Gov offered them ANZAC at a crazily cheap price $120 million IIRC I'll check up on it, the idea was the they would just add their own order on the end to the Tenix build line. Of course this was turned down more the pity.
 
Better still, how about we simply do something to resolve our manning issues and keep the ships in service as intended.
 
alexsa said:
Better still, how about we simply do something to resolve our manning issues and keep the ships in service as intended.
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I quite agree, I'd rather see the manning issue solved by increasing the available pool. "Solving" the problem by reducing available units is no real solution IMV. Having said that though, if the option came available to increase the number of AWD at the cost of an Anzac (or Adelaide) I think that would be worthwhile, regardless of which design for the AWD is selected. Now if the RAN is able to properly man 8 Anzacs AND 4 AWD, even better.

-Cheers
 
alexsa said:
Better still, how about we simply do something to resolve our manning issues and keep the ships in service as intended.
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There is no doubt in my mind that recruitment and retention is now the biggest issue facing the RAN. It must be solved or the RAN will end up with new ships tied up and unable to go to sea. I think that the purchase of powerful new ships provides a real opportunity for the RAN to push its recruitment message, but this message also needs to be supported by good pay and conditions, together with incentives for re-enlistment that are at least equal to and preferably more attractive than what is being offered in civilian employment. Let's hope that tonight's federal budget provides this.

Cheers
 
Tasman said:
There is no doubt in my mind that recruitment and retention is now the biggest issue facing the RAN. It must be solved or the RAN will end up with new ships tied up and unable to go to sea. I think that the purchase of powerful new ships provides a real opportunity for the RAN to push its recruitment message, but this message also needs to be supported by good pay and conditions, together with incentives for re-enlistment that are at least equal to and preferably more attractive than what is being offered in civilian employment. Let's hope that tonight's federal budget provides this.

Cheers
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Seen from Italy the RAN's manning issues seem very strange. We have problems budgeting ships but don't have any trouble finding new recruits (latest recruitment drives provided 2.5 more applications than needed), especially from the poorer regions of Southern Italy where unemployment is above 10% vs 6.5% nationally.
My proposal is obviously too simplistic, but why isn't part of the funding for new constructions programme simply diverted to increase salaries and benefits in order to compete with the private sector ?

cheers
 
contedicavour said:
Seen from Italy the RAN's manning issues seem very strange. We have problems budgeting ships but don't have any trouble finding new recruits (latest recruitment drives provided 2.5 more applications than needed), especially from the poorer regions of Southern Italy where unemployment is above 10% vs 6.5% nationally.
My proposal is obviously too simplistic, but why isn't part of the funding for new constructions programme simply diverted to increase salaries and benefits in order to compete with the private sector ?

cheers
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It's completely the opposite in Australia. Unemployment is running at about 4% nationally IIRC, and a massive mining boom is driving the entire economy. This has created a huge budget surplus for the government so it has more than enough money for new ships - but it can't compete in such a tight job market. Your proposal is of course part of the solution, and improving defence force pay and conditions has been a target for a few years now. There are a whole range of measures aimed at retaining key personnel.

But Defence service is still seen as unattractive to many people because of the discipline, the remote postings and the upset to family life. When times are hard (such as the south of Italy, it seems) people will join Defence for job security, but under Australia's current booming economy it takes more than just increasing pay and conditions to keep numbers coming in, and it's even harder to stop skilled personnel leaving.
 
contedicavour said:
Seen from Italy the RAN's manning issues seem very strange. We have problems budgeting ships but don't have any trouble finding new recruits (latest recruitment drives provided 2.5 more applications than needed), especially from the poorer regions of Southern Italy where unemployment is above 10% vs 6.5% nationally.
My proposal is obviously too simplistic, but why isn't part of the funding for new constructions programme simply diverted to increase salaries and benefits in order to compete with the private sector ?

cheers
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Maybe we should start recruiting Italians. The British army already has a few thousand Fijians, Trinidadians, etc (& Gurkhas, of course). Why not Sicilians in the RN? NATO allies, EU citizens . . . as long as they can speak enough English.
 
swerve said:
Maybe we should start recruiting Italians. The British army already has a few thousand Fijians, Trinidadians, etc (& Gurkhas, of course). Why not Sicilians in the RN? NATO allies, EU citizens . . . as long as they can speak enough English.
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We'd have to get some sawnoff double barrelled shotguns organised, some grappa perhaps, the Godfather theme playing in the background, yes this could work... :D
 
~woke up this morning, grab ur self a gun mumma always said u'd be the...chosen one~

There was a proposed idea for the Army to recruit more pacific islanders into the army, as well as Citizenship in return for service, much like the US does.
Both were rejected because the ADF has strict citizenship rules and does not want to relax them, along with the education requirments and possible health.
Maybe the ADF should keep spending big now incase the mining boom doesn't last or the economy collapses. that way they have the equipment ready and a huge influx of willing recruits without work seeing as how we can have only one or the other.
 
contedicavour said:
Seen from Italy the RAN's manning issues seem very strange. We have problems budgeting ships but don't have any trouble finding new recruits (latest recruitment drives provided 2.5 more applications than needed), especially from the poorer regions of Southern Italy where unemployment is above 10% vs 6.5% nationally.
My proposal is obviously too simplistic, but why isn't part of the funding for new constructions programme simply diverted to increase salaries and benefits in order to compete with the private sector ?

cheers
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For one thing the australian economy is at allmost full employment. Were looking at 4.8% nationaly so there isn't that many young poorer people needing work. Not to mention the very highly paid trades in Australia (sucsessfull electritians can easliy make as much as a lawyer) which means that similar work in the private sector will be much more lucrative. Matching saleries in the private sector would be allmost imposible in some areas and expensive in others. But this is to be expected, whenever a nation has a very strong economic standing and a fully employed labor market with high wages recruitments will suffer. However retention is a biger problem that is easier to fix. Retention rates have less to do with economic conditions than recruitment and more to do with the HR management of the ADF.
 
Ozzy Blizzard said:
For one thing the australian economy is at allmost full employment. Were looking at 4.8% nationaly so there isn't that many young poorer people needing work...
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Unemployment is now 4.4%. A decade ago 5% was considered full employment.
 
sorry, i knew i should have checked those figures before i posted, they only came out today. And full employment is an econimc term i.e. only natural unemployment at 5%. still doesent change my point, enforces it in fact. 4.4% means there is more opportunities in the private sector, and less recruitment.
 
Aussie Digger said:
Switching between sites I know, but what we REALLY want to know is can a RAN ANZAC carry a Phalanx???
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Info on another site is suggesting that topweight is an issue in the Australian Anzacs. I've just posted something about this in Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates .

Cheers
 
Trescu said:
This was a problem for the Spanish Navy, but they together with Navantia designed a new forward exhaust stack and solved the problem without decreasing the capacities of Aegis or influencing the shadow of the ship.

You can see the new exhaust design in this pic:
http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/3158/enero2007fragatapruebasuc1.jpg

In this moment, this new exhaust is installed in all f100.

Best regards.
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Sorry to bring this back up, but it appears the redesigned exhaust isn't that effective.
I took a couple of pics of F-102 a few days ago and it has the updated stack, and while it looks like it is helping it did not solve the problem of the exhaust gasses messing up the aft SPY arrays.
IMG_1354.jpg
 
Details emerge of Australia's Arleigh Burke

Details emerge of Australia's Arleigh Burke
Platform system designer Gibbs and Cox Australia has disclosed the first details of the attributes of the US contender for Australia's air warfare destroyer (AWD) programme. An evolved variant of the US Navy's (USN's) Flight IIA Arleigh Burke-class destroyer is competing with the Spanish F100 frigate for the three-ship, AUD6 billion (USD4.9 billion) AWD programme
[Jane's Navy International - first posted to http://jni.janes.com - 30 April 2007]

Just droped on my E-mail....
 
Whats the scuttlebutt down under over the chances the RAN will actually purchase the Burkes? I thought it was a done deal they would go for another design.
 
There's already a thread for this topic - air warfare destroyers for Australia.

That's right. Threads merged.

/GD
 
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