Australian Army Discussions and Updates

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lobbie111

New Member
They are not going to change the round, it will never happen unless the rest of the world does...although to substantially increase lethality you could use some of these with a traditional cartridge case on the end of it to ease the close quarters problem.
 
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Cutaway

New Member
Maybe a bullpup variant of the:

H&K416
Daewoo K2?
FN SCAR(I dont mean the F2000 as its a 5.56x45 P90)

Or somthing else?
 
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SuperSLime

New Member
Cutaway said:
Maybe a bullpup variant of the:

H&K416
Daewoo K2?
FN SCAR(I dont mean the F2000 as its a 5.56x45 P90)

Or somthing else?
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No.

The trend is away from bullpups and towards conventional rifles with folding or collapsible stocks. Bullpups have poor balance (the weight should be slightly forward for better handling) and the ergonomics are often suspect as well. If the SCAR was going to be better as a bullpup, FN would have built it that way. They know what they're doing.
 
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Cutaway

New Member
But the Enfield EM-2 had a good balance though. If you want a bullpup with a good balance, Have a slightly longer fore end/barrel as Bullpup converted rifles turn out to be too stumpy which not only affects balance but having a front handguard & mounting an underbarrel 40mm(If you want it).

Or somthing like the Interdynamics MKS?, It may give good balance to the firer.
 
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JamieG.CAV

New Member
Hey all,

I'm curremtly an Army Reservist located in SA with 3/9 SAMR (Cav unit)

Anyhow i am enquiring on these forums for a few people knowledgable in the the areas of specific jobs. Ideally those who do the job would be of best help.

Jobs im interested in in going fulltime!

Air Dispatcher
Crewman ASLAV
Fitter Armament

So if anybody on here is one of these or can help me in anyway please contact me [email protected] with info as to what day to day army life is like when you are full time and what the above jobs are REALLY like.
 
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winnyfield

New Member
To get back on track.

New ration packs - *fingers cross* there's a little bottle of tabasco
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/03/22/2196704.htm
Aussie soldiers turn noses up at ration packs
By Nicole Butler
Posted Sat Mar 22, 2008 1:17pm AEDT
(audio)


Forget the chocolate eggs; nutritionists say the traditional Australian army rations aren't appetising enough.

Soldiers are refusing to eat the rations and their health and morale is suffering as a result, and the Army is spending thousands of dollars to make ration packs more appetising.

It seems hard to believe, but experts say the success of military operations is being compromised by the unpalatable ration packs given to our troops.

Australia is part of a hot region and most defence personnel are deployed to high temperature zones.

Soldiers stationed overseas are becoming sick, lethargic and they're under-performing, because they can't bring themselves to eat their pre-packed hot meals.

Chris Forbes-Ewan, a nutritionist with Defence Science and Technology Organisation in Tasmania, says the reason for that is pretty clear that people lose appetite in the heat.

"The current pack includes meals that need to be heated to be fully edible; main meals spaghetti bolognese and beef with noodles and sweet and sour foods and these sorts of things," he said.

"Also freeze-dried rice and potato and onion powder."

Climate-controlled chow

Mr Forbes-Ewan says soldiers need to be given mission-specific ration packs according to the climate they'll be working in.

"While food plays an enormous role in morale, quite often the only thing the soldier has to look forward to is his, or her next meal," he said.

Naturally his team's priority was to develop a hot-weather combat pack, and they've already made a prototype.

"The new pack consists mainly of grazing type foods, eat-on-the-move goods," he said.

"[It includes] trail mix, energy bars, sports bars, sports drink, beef jerky is another one."

The nutritionist says a new heat-resistant Army chocolate is also on the drawing board.

"It's a mood lifter, because it is so popular, it's a good food to fortify with vitamins," he said.

The new hot weather combat supplies are being trialed at the Land Command Battle School near Tully in far north Queensland.

The Federal Minister for Defence Personnel, Warren Snowden, is optimistic the soldiers will like it.

"Soldiers weren't that happy with the current ration packs and weren't eating enough of the ration pack food in the field," he said.

"They are being required to undertake high intensity physical work, which is very stressful, for days at a time often, and we need to make sure that they're operating at their best, not only for their own safety but so that they can complete the missions, which they are being tasked to do and that is the defence of Australia."
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winnyfield

New Member
New body armour in the works. (Didn't the ADF just get new body armour? 'enhanced combat body armour')

http://bendigo.yourguide.com.au/news/local/general/local-firm-wins-80m-contract/1215247.html
Local firm wins $80m contract


A BENDIGO defence firm has won a lucrative $80 million contract to supply the Australian Defence Force with new-generation body armour.

Australian Defence Apparel beat an eminent line-up of 16 international competitors for the five-year tender, which will employ an additional 80 staff at the factory.

The Modular Combat Body Armour System will be used by armed forces from May this year.

.......
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winnyfield

New Member
SuperSLime said:
.... FN would have built it that way. They know what they're doing.
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Wouldn't they have known that US forces are biased against bullpups?

The US firearms community contains the most hostile/active in the question of what the military should or shouldn't have, so its best to be conservative.
 
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SuperSLime

New Member
Cutaway said:
But the Enfield EM-2 had a good balance though.
Click to expand...
Not really; most of the weight was still at the rear.

Cutaway said:
If you want a bullpup with a good balance, Have a slightly longer fore end/barrel
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I don't, though; I want a proper rifle with a folding stock.

Cutaway said:
Or somthing like the Interdynamics MKS?, It may give good balance to the firer.
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I cannot think of a single reason why I would want to be issued with that piece of shit.
 
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SuperSLime

New Member
winnyfield said:
Wouldn't they have known that US forces are biased against bullpups?

The US firearms community contains the most hostile/active in the question of what the military should or shouldn't have, so its best to be conservative.
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It's not just the US forces who're biased against bullpups; I note that the SAS, who could easily have adopted the L85, prefer the Diemaco C7.

Bullpups sound great, especially for use from armoured vehicles, but the balance and ergonomics issues make a conventional rifle superior. Fit a folding stock and it's just as easy to carry in a vehicle.
 
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lobbie111

New Member
SuperSLime said:
It's not just the US forces who're biased against bullpups; I note that the SAS, who could easily have adopted the L85, prefer the Diemaco C7.

Bullpups sound great, especially for use from armoured vehicles, but the balance and ergonomics issues make a conventional rifle superior. Fit a folding stock and it's just as easy to carry in a vehicle.
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Well, the US Navy Seals just bought the new Israeli bulpup, as AD has stated the simple issue with the L85 and any bulpup for that matter is you can hang more stuff off a C7, simple as that, not because of reliability or capability etc. I would argue bulpups actually are more reliable and handle better.

Also the new Isreali Bulpup incorporates weights so the the rifle is prefectly balanced, and in the Australian example a cleaning kit is stored in the back of the Steyr giving it a good balance.

The new Steyr A3/A4 (both from ADI and Steyr) will be the best for special forces IMO more accessory rails than an M4A1 or 416, better barrel system and better multirole capability.

The only thing good that the C7 or the M4 has got going for it is that an M4 is not a common but relatively common weapon in guerilla circles, making it harder for certain special forces units to be identified.
 
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SuperSLime

New Member
lobbie111 said:
I would argue bulpups actually are more reliable and handle better.
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I would argue that you've never used the L85A1, which was an unreliable piece of shit. The reliability of a weapon in no way depends on whether or not it was a bullpup. In four years of using the L1A1 I had exactly three stoppages and the G3 wasn't far behind.

The weight on a bullpup is too far back; the handling suffers because of this. UK grenadiers find that the L85A2 handles much better once the UGL is attached; the penalty is the extra weight on an already heavy weapon.

The L85A2 is now available with an RIS fore-end, allowing all the requred toys to be attached.

lobbie111 said:
The only thing good that the C7 or the M4 has got going for it is that an M4 is not a common but relatively common weapon in guerilla circles.
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Bollocks. Any SF unit trying to blend in with the locals will be carrying AKs. The C7 is a good, reliable weapon. The M4 is good at close range but the short barrel affects long-range effectiveness. There's nothing fundamentally wrong with either of them.

The SEALs and other SF units are TESTING the Tavor. They test EVERYTHING. My bet is that what they actually adopt will be the SCAR.
 
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Chino

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
SuperSLime said:
At various times: L85A1, L85A2, L86A1, G3K, HK33, MP5K and L1A1 SLR. Not all of them were great, but all of them were at least better than that Interdynamics abortion.
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Interesting array but curious at the inclusion of G3 and HK33. In what situation did that got thrown into the mix? Overseas etc?
 
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SuperSLime

New Member
Chino said:
Interesting array but curious at the inclusion of G3 and HK33. In what situation did that got thrown into the mix? Overseas etc?
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Oops, I meant HK53! It's used when a compact weapon is required but you need more range than a 9mm (the HK53 is barely larger than a standard MP5.) The G3K is similar but being 7.62mm is more versatile, while not being too much bigger.
 
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Cutaway

New Member
They may as well just adopt the HK416 or either manufacture thier own M16's, SIG 540/550's, or STANAG compatible Galil's/R4's. Or a front magazined version of the AUG?

The British .19 calibre(4.85mm) that was used in the XL64 rifle was rumoured to have better ballistics and range than the 5.56 NATO
 
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F-15 Eagle

New Member
IMHO I think all countries should replace the 5.56mm with the 6.5mm or 6.8mm. Its not the rifles but the bullets that need to be replaced.
 
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