A400m

[ngatimozart]

As you pointed out earlier in the thread the life of the A400M production is by no means certain (sadly a case of a great idea poorly executed aided by German duplicity, just like with the Tornado).
I don't believe that the idea of taking over AirNZ 777-200ER as the replacement for the 757-200 Combi will be viable. Does NZDF require a 312 seat strategic lift capability? An indication would be how often the 757-200s are tasked (fulfilled and unfulfilled requests). The other question is whether the LD containers (LD3/4/6/7/11/26) and PLA pallets on the lower deck will meet the NZDF strategic cargo requirements? If the strategic lift requirement needed the upper deck converted to a cargo configuration then that would suggest the aircraft are being converted to a dedicated freighter configuration (with the large upper deck cargo door and no windows).
Perhaps the KHI C-2 production line will still be running in 2025-2027 in which case that may be the only option.

I put the B777-200 article there just for comments. Bear in mind that the current government has started like for like wrt the FAMC project. IF the NZG decided to go down the road of the B777-200, it MAY opt for a combi option like it did with the B757-200 Combi. The other point to consider is that the NZG is the majority shareholder (52%) in Air NZ and has just extended it a NZ$900 million loan, so it may see it in its best interest for the 4 B777-200 to be sold to the NZMOD. We just don't know at the moment.

The FAMC project team will recommend a particular solution to Cabinet, but in the end it will be a Cabinet decision based on politics.

 

[swerve]

I reckon if Airbus hung a couple of largish commercial turbofans from the wings, instead of bespoke turboprops, they would of had a winner that could've given them far less grief.

Now to breach posting rules. I hope I'll get away with it.

Complete with big red roundel . . .

 

[ngatimozart]

Now to breach posting rules. I hope I'll get away with it.
Complete with big red roundel . . .

Haha, nice aircraft that. Saw it when it was parked up overnight here in Christchurch about 3 years ago. Unfortunately we weren't able to get a look through it.

 

[MrConservative]

The younger 777-300 might be worth considering especially as Air NZ owns 4, the other 3 are leased. The 777-200s are older. Buying a C2 from an Asian ally and trading partner seems a better choice than a Euro A400 with a troubled history.

Air NZ owns 4 B772ER's and leases another four. They may not fly again, are around 14 years old have recently been D checked and refreshed into a 40/52/192 pax configuration, with the leased aircraft being returned and the aircraft under ownership potentially stored or sold.

However as this thread is about the A400 it is best that further discussions about any future use of that or other aircraft should be discussed on the RNZAF thread. The point also being when you get there that 1) there are no longer plans under the DCP or DWP for an outsize load strategic air mobility capability as all that will be covered via two sealift vessels, and 2) that a commercial airliner based aircraft which can comfortably have no PSR restrictions is preferred and much more indicative of what platform meets the requirements.

 

[OPSSG]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1267837441387495425

The A400M has completed the full industrial development of the type’s paratrooping deployment capacity, with a maximum dispatch of 116 paratroopers using both side doors (58/58). The certification fight test, completed in May 2020 in coordination with the French Armament General Directorate (DGA) and supported by the French and Belgian Armed Forces, combined an extensive paratrooping campaign of more than 1,000 jumps along with the implementation of new capability development methodologies based on recording and 3D modelling of paratrooper jump trajectories.

Complete with a couple of AAR kits, so for the last couple of years Malaysia has had tankers for its fighters.

The Malaysians put their fleet of 4 to full use — having deployed the plane on HADR missions to Bangladesh, Laos and the Philippines since it was first delivered to Malaysia in 2015.

In May 2018, refueling trials were conducted with the A400M using RMAF Boeing F/A-18D Hornets, Russian-made Sukhoi Su-30MKM fighters and BAE Systems Hawk trainer/light-attack jets as receivers.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1176441156349157378

The A400M and H225M doing AAR. Original 24 m hoses found to be too short, so 37 m hoses used instead. New hoses are thinner, so no weight penalty, but reduced flow means AAR takes longer.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1101010829149790209

The RMAF has also deployed Airbus A400M aircraft to support Covid-19 relief operations in the country. One Airbus A400M aircraft was used to transport essential medical supplies, equipment and personal protective equipment (PPE) to the East Malaysian states of Sabah and Sarawak. The deliveries included around three million face masks.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1258690874264993792

I wonder, how big was the bird that hit the Spanish A400M? Must be huge.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1267837441387495425

The A400M has completed the full industrial development of the type’s paratrooping deployment capacity, with a maximum dispatch of 116 paratroopers using both side doors (58/58). The certification fight test, completed in May 2020 in coordination with the French Armament General Directorate (DGA) and supported by the French and Belgian Armed Forces, combined an extensive paratrooping campaign of more than 1,000 jumps along with the implementation of new capability development methodologies based on recording and 3D modelling of paratrooper jump trajectories.

The Malaysians put their fleet of 4 to full use — having deployed the plane on HADR missions to Bangladesh, Laos and the Philippines since it was first delivered to Malaysia in 2015.

In May 2018, refueling trials were conducted with the A400M using RMAF Boeing F/A-18D Hornets, Russian-made Sukhoi Su-30MKM fighters and BAE Systems Hawk trainer/light-attack jets as receivers.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1176441156349157378

The A400M and H225M doing AAR. Original 24 m hoses found to be too short, so 37 m hoses used instead. New hoses are thinner, so no weight penalty, but reduced flow means AAR takes longer.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1101010829149790209

The RMAF has also deployed Airbus A400M aircraft to support Covid-19 relief operations in the country. One Airbus A400M aircraft was used to transport essential medical supplies, equipment and personal protective equipment (PPE) to the East Malaysian states of Sabah and Sarawak. The deliveries included around three million face masks.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1258690874264993792

I wonder, how big was the bird that hit the Spanish A400M? Must be huge.

Having also the BAe Hawk, Su-30 and EC725, the A400M is almost perfect for the TNI-AU. The only problem will be that Indonesia's F-16 still needs something like the A330MRTT.

About the bird impact of the Spanish A400M....this is really a remarkable case. That under such angle such a thick layer of composite material is completely destroyed by a bird.

Ive seen in real life the result of many bird impacts on undercarriage, taxi lights, landing lights, wing leading edges, radome...many of them full frontal hit.
But looking to the Spanish A400M, it almost looks like it has been hit by a Struthio camelus.

Anyway, maybe its already posted before here, but this video really shows the amazing STOL capabilities of the C-130J and A400M.

 

[kato]

I wonder, how big was the bird that hit the Spanish A400M? Must be huge.

According to Spanish newspapers it was a vulture. Depending on species these reach between 2m and 3m wingspan. Plenty of them around Zaragoza.

 

[John Fedup]

According to Spanish newspapers it was a vulture. Depending on species these reach between 2m and 3m wingspan. Plenty of them around Zaragoza.

Must have been a heavy bugger.

 

[ngatimozart]

Must have been a heavy bugger.

We have Albatross that nest near Dunedin in the South Island. It's the only mainland albatross nesting colony anywhere in the world. Been there once and they have a pretty massive wingspan of about 3 m. They aren't small birds. When I was in Queensland on holiday, was up close and personal with a sea eagle, think it was a wedgetail. It too was a big bird with a large wingspan. Both birds would do a fair whack of damage if they hit an aircraft.

 

[Brucedog]

Wedgetail and Sea Eagles are not the same. Wedgetail has a wingspan of over 2.8m, the Sea Eagle 2.2.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Is it badluck, are all the birds in Spain that huge, or is the skin of the A400M that weak?

25 June 2020 - Spanish Air Force Airbus A400M military strategic transporter airlifter damaged following a bird strike while operating at Getafe Air Base, Spain.

Similar incident on a Spanish Air Force A400M damaged following a bird strike while operating at Zaragoza Air Base, Spain in May 2020.

images - Spanish Air Force

 

[kato]

25 June 2020 - Spanish Air Force Airbus A400M military strategic transporter airlifter damaged following a bird strike while operating at Getafe Air Base, Spain.

Was a Royal Air Force plane this time, not Spanish.

Is it badluck, are all the birds in Spain that huge, or is the skin of the A400M that weak?

Bird strikes are moderately common, probably the second-highest cause of accident for military aircraft after engine malfunctions. And with sufficient mass and speed there's bound to be damage. Last one of similar gravity in Europe was an Alpha Jet in France last week. Bird strike on the cockpit, cracking it. Probably a bit smaller than this one though.

For the A400M it's the engines that are tested for bird strikes. They can ingest up to 1.85 kg of high-speed poultry while recovering to keep running. That basically covers all bird species in Europe except for those Spanish vultures, a couple larger kinds of eagles and swans.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

So, actually because of a lack of decent maritime patrol aircraft (the Nimrods were retired without a replacement), the UK now uses the A400M as an MPA.

UK deploys A400M on counter-migrant mission

A UK Royal Air Force (RAF) A400M transport was re-roled to fly a surveillance mission over the Strait of Dover on 10 August in response to attempts by migrants to cross...

www.janes.com

 

[OPSSG]

@Sandhi Yudha

Thanks for the update. It is an interesting use of the A400M — similar to the RSAF’s use of its C-130Hs in the past to assist in the search for missing airliners.

the Nimrods were retired without a replacement

Minor correction, the first of nine P-8A's, ordered by the British in 2016 at a cost of £3 billion ($3.9 billion), arrived in Feb 2020, at the Kinloss base. These will replace the Nimrods.

 

[oldsig127]

@Sandhi Yudha

Thanks for the update. It is an interesting use of the A400M — similar to the RSAF’s use of its C-130Hs in the past to assist in the search for missing airliners.

Minor correction, the first of nine P-8A's, ordered by the British in 2016 at a cost of £3 billion ($3.9 billion), arrived in Feb 2020, at the Kinloss base. These will replace the Nimrods.

They will, but @Sandhi Yudha is correct. They will be replaced by the P-8 but at the time they were retired, in I believe 2011, there was no replacement, nor even a published project with funding for replacement
The first order was placed in around 2016

Royal Air Force [RAF] discussions and updates

I know the UK isn't in the greatest financial position right now and we are still to get some of the later deliveries of Typhoon but when will serious consideration start being given to whatever platform succeeds it? Given that it takes a fair while just to do initial design studies let alone...

www.defencetalk.com

oldsig

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Thank you gentlemen...
The same situation like the Harrier. Retired long before the first F-35B came in operation.

Politicians just do not (want) to realize that budgetcuts have a negative effect for a long period.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

This capability can make the A400M more attractive on the market, if the problems with the engine are solved.

A400M conducts first 'wet' air-to-air refuelling with a helicopter

An Airbus A400M transport/tanker aircraft has conducted a 'wet' air-to-air refuelling (AAR) contact with a helicopter, it was announced by the French Direction Générale...

www.janes.com

 

[Redlands18]

This capability can make the A400M more attractive on the market, if the problems with the engine are solved.

A400M conducts first 'wet' air-to-air refuelling with a helicopter

An Airbus A400M transport/tanker aircraft has conducted a 'wet' air-to-air refuelling (AAR) contact with a helicopter, it was announced by the French Direction Générale...

www.janes.com

I think that just about sums up the entire A400M saga, there is definitely a strong market for a Airlifter in this class but even original customers have cut orders back due to the ongoing issues.

 

[OPSSG]

I think that just about sums up the entire A400M saga, there is definitely a strong market for a Airlifter in this class but even original customers have cut orders back due to the ongoing issues.

Things have not worked out as planned.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1296074199774253056

Eventually, the Bundeswehr will be able to transport two Boxers using three A400Ms. The max payload of an A400M is 37 tons, but the load ramp limit is 32 tonnes. Given that the Boxer weighs 35, the mission module has to be separated and loaded onto a second A400M.

 

[kato]

Given that the Boxer weighs 35, the mission module has to be separated and loaded onto a second A400M.

Technically the mission module could be loaded right behind that Boxer onto the same aircraft, although tieing that down would likely be quite complicated. Separating the mission module takes about 20 minutes and a crane or heavy forklift, and is thus not an issue.

The proposed three-aircraft-for-two-Boxers solution splits the payload nicely into 25-ton packages, meaning equivalent larger range envelope for all three and staying within the margins for "tactical transport".

There's an official video for the Boxer loading trials on the A400M CHT loading simulator:

Things have not worked out as planned.

32 tons have always been the planned limit for single-unit transportability. That's why the Puma IFV has about 11 tons of its weight in add-on armor modules and onboard equipment to be removed for air transport to bring it to something like 31.8 tons.

It should be noted with regard to Boxer that the module weight has increased "a bit" over the last 15 years. Originally the maximum intended module weight was 8 tons, bringing the vehicle to 33.2t GVW and, removing troops carried and such, was intended to fit a air-transportability weight of ... yep, 31.8 tons.
However in 2012 in Afghanistan Germany decided that they wanted better mine protection and hence switched over to "A1", which added about 3 tons weight, mostly in armor. In 2016 this was further refined to "A2" adding mostly electronics and controls, which brings the vehicle to its current GVW of 36.5 tons.


P.S. Regarding the "In some instances, the Bundeswehr found that "some chains cannot be attached as planned because a component of the boxer or simply a bolt is in the way.":

The group shown is the air transport trials group of Air Transport Wing 62, which is the sole group deciding how a vehicle can be transported on a Bundeswehr A400M, including lashing plans. They were provided with a theoretical lashing plan by KMW and Rheinmetall, which they adapted "until it worked", fully as intended.