is that such a problem we have two AAW missiles anyway i know one short range and the other is long range. but wouldn't the MK47 lanchers be usful so the could hold tomakhawks as well as harpoon and the standered loadout of ESSMs and SM-2s. i know it would be new logistical berden but it would add new flexablitiy to the RN fleet.
also new news on the CVF it is comming
Yahoo Babel Fish text translate:26/10/2006
The program of the three Franco-British aircraft carriers, designed in co-
operation between the two countries, seem to want to pass at the higher speed, expiries political oblige. Tomorrow, the Anglo-Saxon industrialists and the ministry for British Defense must cross the "Hand gate", the equivalent of the file of launching and realization (DLR), opening the way with a ordering of the HMS Queen Elisabeth and Prince of semi-2007 Wales. During this time, in France, the second aircraft carrier advances, him too. After the signature, September 25, contract for the detailed studies of definition, that we revealed you later two days, DCN and Thales must present before the end of December an engaging offer to the General Delegation for Armament (DGA). The three months separating these two stakes are devoted to refine the budget necessary to the realization of the new aircraft carrier, whose cost is always estimated at more than 2 billion euros. Since the signature of the cooperation agreement between Paris and London, the Memorandum of Understanding (SOFT), last at the beginning of March, the teams of MOPA2, common company of DCN and Thales in load of the program, received the British plans and studies gradually (1400 documents). These documents, screen, made it possible to confirm that France could use the British design for its own ship, with the help of some adaptations.
The English adopt French dimensions
These last months, an intensive work was undertaken between Paris and Bristol, where are gathered the British industrialists and where about fifteen French work permanently. Tricolour side, one estimates that the discussions profitable, are facilitated by the British interest for the expertise of DCN as regards aircraft carrier, a type of ship that Great Britain did not realize since the Fifties. If, initially, the version on takeoff court of the F 35 is planned for Fleet Air ARM, Royal Navy plans, thereafter, to be able to install catapults on its ships. This question is all the more crucial as the program Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) knows large turbulences and the threats of an abandonment of version ADAC/ADAV are still not completely isolated. However, it seems that initially, the English industrialists did not envisage sufficient place for the catapults and the associated machinery. In September, Aircraft Carrier Alliance thus lined up with the French proposals on dimensions of the flight deck, a factor dimensioning for the catapult-launched planes. On their side, the British launched, in July, 13 consultations relating to subsets. This equipment, not yet selected, relates to the propulsion and the systems of platform (electric elevators, hoists, devices, tackle of dampings, winches, capstans...) Proof that work in co-operation starts to bear its fruits, Bristol accepted, within the framework of the procedure of joint acquisitions, to include, at the request of the French, the suppliers not envisaged in the beginning. The objective of the co-operation remains, obviously, to limit the total cost of the aircraft carriers by preserving, to the maximum, the community of design. The purchase of common equipment and possible similar programs of maintenance will come to amplify this step. This summer, at the time of the review of design with the DGA and the navy, DCN and Thales estimated that the French building (CVF-FR or Pa 2) could be common to a little more than 80% with his/her English cousins (Carrier Vessels Future - CVF). The ministry for Defense wished, nevertheless, that the two groups do better and approach the 90%, which would be E passes to be obtained.
The question of the armament and the propulsion
With the wire of the studies, the future aircraft carrier took weight, passing from 65.000 to 74.000 tons, that is to say 32.000 tons more than the Charles of Gaulle for a higher length of 22 meters. The surface of the flight deck reaches from now on 15.700 m², against 12.000 m² for the CDG and 8000 m² for the ex-Clemenceau. The difference in size is explained mainly by two great factors. The first lies in the importance of the air group, carried from 24 to 32 Rafale Marine, apparatuses twin-jet aircrafts with nonfolding wings whose replacements are relatively cumbersome. The equipment in helicopters and the planes of guet air (5 NH 90 and 3 E2-C Hawkeye) remains unchanged. The other dimensioning factor remains the propulsion which, contrary to the Charles of Gaulle, will not be nuclear but traditional. Having electric motors of propulsion and two gas turbines for the dash speeds (26 n?uds), the ship must have important fuel compartments, absent on its predecessor. The choice of the type of propulsion is not stopped yet. Aker Yards, DCN Propulsion and the ex-APC (Rolls-Royce group) propose to equip the CVF and CVF-FR with two pods and a line of trees. This formula had already been retained for the five steamers of the class Voyageur of the Seas (138.300 barrels), delivered by Aker Finnyards (ex-Kvaerner) between 1999 and 2003. This system offers the advantage of improving the maneuverability of the ships considerably and of reducing the vulnerability of the propelling apparatus. Moreover, one new generation of pods, more economic, is proposed. These nacelles, which have a propeller in conduit, directed towards the back, would offer a better output, about 10%: "the boat can go more quickly with less propelling power and, with the pods, one gains place", explains an engineer. The Masters of?uvres are not, however, very receptive with these arguments "the problem, it is that this system is not qualified", affirms a close relation of the file, while adding: "It is not rejected. If the British go there, one will go can be ". In addition to the propulsion, French and British discuss also much on the armament, whereas Royal Navy leaned for a self-defence of lightest. A few months ago still, only a launcher Sylver (8 missiles Aster 15) was to be embarked and no chaff launcher was considered initially, although spaces are envisaged. Light better from now on is noted with, in particular, two launchers Sylver (16 missiles), which remains always twice less important than the armament of the Charles of Gaulle. Since the cold war, time when this ship was designed, it should be said that the threat has, it also, evolved/moved.
An order before the presidential one of 2007?
The principal asset and the principal threat of this program reside in the political factor. Carried by Jacques Chirac, who put a term at the will of DCN to build a derivative of the Charles of Gaulle while choosing the traditional propulsion in 2004, opening the way with the co-operation, the second aircraft carrier could make the expenses of future budgetary restrictions or a change of governmental course as regards defense. Accordingly, the presidential election of May 2007 will be determining. For Michele Alliot-Marie: "It will be difficult to stop a co-operation full and whole which functions perfectly under the impulse of a will shared by France and the United Kingdom" (*). And the minister of Defense to insert the nail: "the very significant amount of commitment appropriation envisaged in programming of finance law 2007, is 700 M?, illustrate well that the decision of launching the realization of the PA2 is a firm decision, final, on which we invest ". Yesterday, to Euronaval, Michele Alliot-Marie added that it wished to make the program "irreversible" and called the industrialists with "a mobilization with the height of the strategic importance of this file". The majority of the potential candidates to the supreme nomination not seeming to have a taste as pronounced for this project as the current Head of the State, the program enter, gradually, in a phase of "security". In this step, the weight of already committed budgets will be determining. In more of the contracts of studies signed with DCN in December 2004 (16 M?) and December 2005 (19.6 M?), it is necessary from now on to add the invoice of September 25. If the amount of this contract were still not revealed, it would be, according to a source close to the file: "definitely more important than the last contract relay". In same time, pursuant to SLACKNESS, France already poured with British industry 45 million euros in March and 35 million euros this summer (right of access to the studies). Does the cooperation agreement envisage, moreover, a third envelope of 65 M? if the program is notified, which could finally intervene before the presidential one, for example at the time one to summon European in March or April. Lastly, Paris would currently be in negotiation with the United States for the ordering of certain equipment very expensive and long to manufacture, as the catapults. In the event of abandonment of Pa 2, the note will thus be salted for the taxpayer and door of consequences for Europe of Defense. According to the specialists, the British government maintenance him also this program under the shield of the European co-operation. From where this comment of an industrialist: "They will be three aircraft carriers or nothing".
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thats a lot of info but the CVF is now at 74.000 tonnes
