Hellenic Navy

[PetranPireotis]

Apart from Burkes which are a 10year "Bla-bla" in Greece and FRemms which 6 meant to be built in Greek Shipyards has anyone else heard any update in Hellenic Navy program? I think Greece has to play a firefighting role in Eastern Med ... Turkey is a giant but has a lot of problems now... I don't think they will complete their nice and ambitious shipbuilding program

 

[Ananda]

Seems someone already created Greece Navy Thread, so I put this article in here.

Greek and Israeli Shipyards signed a cooperation agreement for the Themistocles-class corvette - Naval Post- Naval News and Information

ONEX Neorion Shipyards of Greece and Israel Shipyards signed a cooperation agreement for the construction of the Themistocles-class corvette during Greek

navalnews.net

Seems this is Greece answer to Turkey Ada/Milgem class Corvettes. Bit smaller than Turkish one, but similar class of weapon suits. Since it's cooperating with Israel, the cut off shown influence from Israel SAAR 5.

 

[OPSSG]

Seems this is Greece answer to Turkey Ada/Milgem class Corvettes. Bit smaller than Turkish one, but similar class of weapon suits. Since it's cooperating with Israel, the cut off shown influence from Israel SAAR 5.

Thanks. Here is a link to a video of the 800 ton Themistocles-class corvette.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1275431383872212992

Does not mention the type of missiles to be used on the 72 metre long corvette. Will have to wait for details to emerge.

From what I see, it is not a impressive design other than the fact that they try to squeeze out space for a lot of weapons. I think the bridge is a bit too far forward for my liking.

 

[ngatimozart]

Yep it looks a bit small and cramped. Almost top heavy. Maybe if they went for 80 m or even 85 m, that would make a power of difference, giving a wider range of capability options, but at a price, however steel is cheap and air is free.

 

[StobieWan]

Ex RN sweeper meets her end :

Container ship MAERSK LAUNCESTON cut in two Greek Navy ship in collision

 

[Systems Adict]

Ex RN sweeper meets her end :

Container ship MAERSK LAUNCESTON cut in two Greek Navy ship in collision

Been following this on Face Ache since about 3pm UK time, when I saw some of the still images of the former HMS Berkley. The damage is centred around the back end of the Engine room by the auxiliary engine, so the ship has effectively remained afloat as that engine room bulkhead has held.

I've also been "reliably informed" by a colleague from work, that the bit just aft of where the damage ends contained the main magazine for all the underwater ordnance. In other words it's scattered across the seabed, along with the rest of the ship...

Likely that both ship's companies will be held ashore till Maritime investigation teams can confirm whom is at fault, although I've seen comments that the container ship Captain has been arrested.

 

[Pusser01]

Noting Quorn & Atherstone have recently been sold to Lithuania & are unavailable, could some of the equipment from Kallisto be transferred into the ex-Walney as a replacement? With Walney being laid-up since 2014 she might not be in a state for reactivation however.

 

[Ananda]

From Xavier sites. Talking on competition for Four Greece Frigates program. Seems for me the typical packages the vendors offer similar in term:
1. Provide localisation in building (either all or 3 from 4),
2. Provide stop gap solution (usually give at least two from ex Vendors nation Navy),
3. Willing to give upgrade to Greece Navy existing Meko Frigates.

The competitors also have similarities with what vendors that competing around the world recently. At least to Indonesian Frigates program, there are Fincantieri, Damen, Babcock, Naval Group. However minus Japan MHI, but they're US LM and German Meko design.

Interesting that the German is the only vendor that refuse to talk to Xavier. Either they're not have ready packages or they're planning on more covert campaign.

 

[Ananda]

France to supply frigates, corvettes for Greek navy | eKathimerini.com

Greece and France have reached an agreement for the supply of French FDI frigates and Gowind-class corvettes for the Hellenic Navy, Kathimerini understands.

www.ekathimerini.com

FDI Frigates and Gowind Corvettes for Greece ? - Naval News

Several Greek media reported over the weekend that Greece would be on the verge of selecting a French offer for the Hellenic Navy new frigate requirement. The offer would consist of FDI (Belharra) frigates and Gowind corvettes.

www.navalnews.com

Seems Naval Group will have better fortune with Greece. Eventough it's not official yet, but seems news site and defense online from within Greece it self have shown similar news on this Naval Acquisition Projects.

From the news it self, seems Greece will divide their procurement on FDI (Belhara) Frigates and Gowind Corvettes. The package seems will be long time sustainment support. Also Naval Group will provide aggressive time line delivery with combination of building in France and Greece yards.

Geopolitically it's also shown continue French support with Greece toward it's rivalry's with Turkey. Seems this is also the factor that bring Greece on taking more defense deals with France, after Rafale.

 

[icelord]

France to supply frigates, corvettes for Greek navy | eKathimerini.com

Greece and France have reached an agreement for the supply of French FDI frigates and Gowind-class corvettes for the Hellenic Navy, Kathimerini understands.

www.ekathimerini.com

FDI Frigates and Gowind Corvettes for Greece ? - Naval News

Several Greek media reported over the weekend that Greece would be on the verge of selecting a French offer for the Hellenic Navy new frigate requirement. The offer would consist of FDI (Belharra) frigates and Gowind corvettes.

www.navalnews.com

Seems Naval Group will have better fortune with Greece. Eventough it's not official yet, but seems news site and defense online from within Greece it self have shown similar news on this Naval Acquisition Projects.

From the news it self, seems Greece will divide their procurement on FDI (Belhara) Frigates and Gowind Corvettes. The package seems will be long time sustainment support. Also Naval Group will provide aggressive time line delivery with combination of building in France and Greece yards.

Geopolitically it's also shown continue French support with Greece toward it's rivalry's with Turkey. Seems this is also the factor that bring Greece on taking more defense deals with France, after Rafale.

Suprised by the Gowind announcement. Greece wanted the Meko upgraded so they didnt have to train in 2 new ships capabilities given they hadnt upgraded the class with anything major in over 10 years. Just means they will have Meko hulls for a few extra years but early retirement if they dont upgrade. I'd expect more then 3 Gowind if thats the case.

No interim ship with 3 FDI to be built and new build Gowind. It looks like France read the tender and went with their own plan instead...unusual for them

Damen Sigma looked strong and have good build reputation with other countries. UK type 31 was pushing the envelope but interim was good options.

Italian FREMM being the USN future frigate would have been good option as USN will have long supply chain for parts compared to what Italy will have as well as future upgrades to opt in. But building Italian Frigates for Greece...

US offering freedom class with their struggling reputation, which i admit has come good, was going to be an investment in PR. It would have given Greece strong USN ties but America wouldn't be involved in the Turkey debate unlike France.

Politics wins all bids in the end.

 

[Redlands18]

Suprised by the Gowind announcement. Greece wanted the Meko upgraded so they didnt have to train in 2 new ships capabilities given they hadnt upgraded the class with anything major in over 10 years. Just means they will have Meko hulls for a few extra years but early retirement if they dont upgrade. I'd expect more then 3 Gowind if thats the case.

No interim ship with 3 FDI to be built and new build Gowind. It looks like France read the tender and went with their own plan instead...unusual for them

Damen Sigma looked strong and have good build reputation with other countries. UK type 31 was pushing the envelope but interim was good options.

Italian FREMM being the USN future frigate would have been good option as USN will have long supply chain for parts compared to what Italy will have as well as future upgrades to opt in. But building Italian Frigates for Greece...

US offering freedom class with their struggling reputation, which i admit has come good, was going to be an investment in PR. It would have given Greece strong USN ties but America wouldn't be involved in the Turkey debate unlike France.

Politics wins all bids in the end.

Interesting design the FDI with the Tumblehome Bow and a length to beam ratio of just 6.7, compare that to a Meko 200 which is 8.4 on a similar length hull.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

France to supply frigates, corvettes for Greek navy | eKathimerini.com

Greece and France have reached an agreement for the supply of French FDI frigates and Gowind-class corvettes for the Hellenic Navy, Kathimerini understands.

www.ekathimerini.com

FDI Frigates and Gowind Corvettes for Greece ? - Naval News

Several Greek media reported over the weekend that Greece would be on the verge of selecting a French offer for the Hellenic Navy new frigate requirement. The offer would consist of FDI (Belharra) frigates and Gowind corvettes.

www.navalnews.com

Seems Naval Group will have better fortune with Greece. Eventough it's not official yet, but seems news site and defense online from within Greece it self have shown similar news on this Naval Acquisition Projects.

From the news it self, seems Greece will divide their procurement on FDI (Belhara) Frigates and Gowind Corvettes. The package seems will be long time sustainment support. Also Naval Group will provide aggressive time line delivery with combination of building in France and Greece yards.

Geopolitically it's also shown continue French support with Greece toward it's rivalry's with Turkey. Seems this is also the factor that bring Greece on taking more defense deals with France, after Rafale.

An MoU for three FTI/Belharra class has been signed, but nothing yet about the Gowind class corvettes.

Greece Signs MOU with Naval Group and MBDA for FDI Frigates - Naval News

Greece signs a memorandum of understanding (MOU) with Naval Group and MBDA opening negotiations for the supply of three FDI HN frigates plus one in option.

www.navalnews.com

 

[Ananda]

Ahh @Sandhi Yudha you beat me on this . Yes seems Gowind deals are coming from mostly Greece media, that got information from their defense sources. Seems Greece calculate that building Gowind will be more economical in long run than refurbishing Meko 200.

Perhaps Gowind will be on separate deals, cause it's speculate that it will be build by Greece Shipyards. Not surprising since Egyptian and Malaysian Gowind based Corvettes/Light Frigates also being build in local shipyard.

 

[kato]

Yes seems Gowind deals are coming from mostly Greece media, that got information from their defense sources.

Kathimerini is supposed to have (non-official) sources directly in the ministry of defense, and tends to be quite reliable if perhaps sometimes a bit patriotic in their reporting.

P.S.: A grain of salt has to be taken even with Kathimerini though, since they're only as good as what their sources are fed, and procurement switches and "well, this was just a MoU" in Greece are as common as in Indonesia for comparison.

 

[Ananda]

Greece signs LOI with the Netherlands for 2 Frigates and 6 MCM Vessels - Naval News

The Hellenic defense procurement agency (GDDIA) and the Dutch Defense Materiel Organization (DMO) signed on 27 October 2021 a letter of intent (LOI) for the transfer of two Karel Doorman-class (M-class) frigates and 6 Alkmaar-class (Tripartite-class) mine countermeasures (MCM) vessels

www.navalnews.com

So, Greece looking to Netherland for their interim Frigates. At the same time seems Greece going to take most of what's left on Tripartite MCMV in Dutch Navy.

 

[icelord]

I was

Greece signs LOI with the Netherlands for 2 Frigates and 6 MCM Vessels - Naval News

The Hellenic defense procurement agency (GDDIA) and the Dutch Defense Materiel Organization (DMO) signed on 27 October 2021 a letter of intent (LOI) for the transfer of two Karel Doorman-class (M-class) frigates and 6 Alkmaar-class (Tripartite-class) mine countermeasures (MCM) vessels

www.navalnews.com

So, Greece looking to Netherland for their interim Frigates. At the same time seems Greece going to take most of what's left on Tripartite MCMV in Dutch Navy.

I was Wondering when Greece would start picking from the multiple options on the table.

Every country (lets face it, the companies were Govt driven) offered a package that ensured the supplier made a profit and got most out of it.

They are basically addressing the issues they have on a budget but picking up 8 MCM and 2 older frigates at risk of not funding Meko upgrade points to greater issues with the fleet then they are willing to admit.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Besides the two Karel Doormanklasse (M-Klasse) frigates and the six Alkmaarklasse minehunters, the Netherlands now also offer de Koninklijke Schelde SIGMA 10514 frigate to the Hellenic Navy. The offered design will be very similar with the Indonesian 10514 version.

Hellas already signed a MoU with France for three FTI/Belharra frigates, but the Hellenic Navy has many Netherlands naval ships in its fleet, so both the SIGMA 10514 and Gowind Class make a good chance.

Dutch shipyard DAMEN submits its SIGMA 10514 frigate for Hellenic Navy

According to information published on the "Naval Defence" website on November 9, 2021, the Dutch shipyard Damen has submitted a proposal to respond to the

www.navyrecognition.com

 

[Redlands18]

Besides the two Karel Doormanklasse (M-Klasse) frigates and the six Alkmaarklasse minehunters, the Netherlands now also offer de Koninklijke Schelde SIGMA 10514 frigate to the Hellenic Navy. The offered design will be very similar with the Indonesian 10514 version.

Hellas already signed a MoU with France for three FTI/Belharra frigates, but the Hellenic Navy has many Netherlands naval ships in its fleet, so both the SIGMA 10514 and Gowind Class make a good chance.

Dutch shipyard DAMEN submits its SIGMA 10514 frigate for Hellenic Navy

According to information published on the "Naval Defence" website on November 9, 2021, the Dutch shipyard Damen has submitted a proposal to respond to the

www.navyrecognition.com

I can't see how a mix of Belharra and 10514 would make a lot of sense for Greece, surely an all Sigma fleet or a combined Belharra/Gowind fleet would be far better. You can get the Sigma,s in 91m, 98m, 105m and 115m.

 

[Redlands18]

Greece – Multi-Mission Surface Combatant (Hellenic Future Frigate (HF2)) | Defense Security Cooperation Agency

www.dsca.mil

Greece – MEKO Class Frigate Modernization | Defense Security Cooperation Agency

www.dsca.mil

This project gets more and more interesting every day. The Americans appear to be in the mix now as well, with the DSCA clearing a possible sale of 4 Frigates based on the Freedom LCS design and an upgrade package for the 4 MEKO 200 Frigates.
This of course is only a clearance for a possible sale

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Greece – Multi-Mission Surface Combatant (Hellenic Future Frigate (HF2)) | Defense Security Cooperation Agency

www.dsca.mil

Greece – MEKO Class Frigate Modernization | Defense Security Cooperation Agency

www.dsca.mil

This project gets more and more interesting every day. The Americans appear to be in the mix now as well, with the DSCA clearing a possible sale of 4 Frigates based on the Freedom LCS design and an upgrade package for the 4 MEKO 200 Frigates.
This of course is only a clearance for a possible sale

In this article we can read that Greece has a three-part plan:
"Greece has an ongoing competition for a three-part plan: upgrade its four Hydra-class MEKO 200 frigates; obtain an interim capability it can operate while the MEKOs are at the maintenance yard; and buy four new frigates."

And it seems the US will offer this plan for the second part,
that the US Navy will provide four decommissioned ships — potentially decommissioned LCSs or cruisers, as the interim solution.

State Department approves potential frigate sale to Greece, despite agreement with France

Though France in September announced an agreement to sell Greece three frigates, Greece asked the U.S. to continue finalizing its proposal for four new frigates, modernizing existing Hellenic Navy ships and providing an interim solution for Greek sailors to use during that modernization effort.

www.defensenews.com