Royal Australian Air Force [RAAF] News, Discussions and Updates

Sea Toby

New Member
The above media video is a one sided hack job. How do I know, the implication of the words what if? You can't discuss any issue and change anyone's mind when they get away with what ifs. You might as well as be discussing religion. Its the same tactics anti-nuclear activists use. For example, what if the water table rises in the future and exposing radioactive wastes to the water table? We are talking about a place in Nevada, in solid rock. 99.9 percent of the radioactive waste disappear in 100 years, and 99.9 percent of that disappears in the next 100 years..... not thousands. And believe it or not, by that time the radioactivity is much less than the mineral uranium being dug up. Of course, you never hear the what if the uranium that currently exists on the surface is safe from the water table. No physics or science involved, just wrong headed opinions.

Its a joint program. The specifications are being met, although the costs have risen. The only reduction of capability I have heard is with the shrinking of the F-35Bs internal bomb bay, to save weight and to create room for the extra engine for vertical take offs and landings. There aren't going to be more changes in design. And as been seen in the past, price isn't driving its design that much.

How can the Raptor's price come down when the last American bought and built aircraft was in last year's budget?

Again, no mention of the GAO report on the Raptor, only with the Lightning IIs. Again, the falsehood of the Raptor having more range. I can't believe the Aussies are eating this bull.

Half way through a development program and the media implies what ifs. The television journalist should have his license to print lies withdrawned. Very poor journalism. Balance of information, zero.
 
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lobbie111

New Member
Hahahahahahaha...His name is GOON sorry about that I had to let that out...The fact the he is a FORMER squadron leader almost writes hime off on the issue, (although I do realise that this is discounting my own opinion). He was a leader when the SOP was to flood the air with the biggest fighters possible, and Australias strategic interests were changed.
 

battlensign

New Member
That's not a hatchet job.....THIS is a hatchet job...

Mod edit:

Gentleman, I pretty sure the Obey Amendment hasn't been removed in the week or so since we asked for discussion on the F-22 in relation to RAAF to end, UNTIL it is available...

There's plenty of topics to discuss. Let's leave this to those who obsess over it, eh?
 
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Goknub

Active Member
RAAF future

Ok, does anyone have any new info on the Maritime Patrol UAVs being sort?

I'm personally in favour of the Mariner UAV, largely because it would provide commonality if the RAAF/Army were to get REAPER UAVs. A full Squadron of Reapers is a capability that would be very useful for all parties.

As good as it is I believe the Global Hawk demonstrates some of the limitations for pilot-less aircraft, essentially that for $60 million (last I heard) keeping a pilot around to ensure the thing doesn't plow into the ground is cost-effective. Even if the pilot spends most of the time playing a PSP and sleeping, having a human on board reduces risk.
 

Magoo

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Ok, does anyone have any new info on the Maritime Patrol UAVs being sort?
The US Navy's BAMS decision is due to be made next week (April 16 I think), and the RAAF is then likely to decide its A7K/1 shortly after the White Paper has been published. If Global Hawk of Mariner win BAMS, the RAAF may end up choosing the same, but in the unlikely event the unmanned G550 gets up, then the RAAF will go its own way.

I'm personally in favour of the Mariner UAV, largely because it would provide commonality if the RAAF/Army were to get REAPER UAVs. A full Squadron of Reapers is a capability that would be very useful for all parties.
There is talk of filling that 'middle ground' between the HALE and the smaller Scan Eagle type UAVs, however there is currently no active project for this.

As good as it is I believe the Global Hawk demonstrates some of the limitations for pilot-less aircraft, essentially that for $60 million (last I heard) keeping a pilot around to ensure the thing doesn't plow into the ground is cost-effective. Even if the pilot spends most of the time playing a PSP and sleeping, having a human on board reduces risk.
I don't understand your argument here - both the Mariner and Global Hawk will require the standby 'pilots', especially when transitting, or operating near or in controlled airspace. The advantages Mariner have over Global Hawk is in operating economics (turboprop vs jet, less complexity overall), acquisiton cost, and the ability to operate at lower altitudes, and even then some of those arguments can be countered.

A kitted out Mariner costs about US$25m, while a Global can cost more than US$60m, but because they fly higher and faster, you'll require fewer Globals to do the work. At the end of the day I don't think there's much in it, so I suspect capability will be the dominant factor in the eventual decision.

Magoo
 

PETERn

New Member
While browsing a web site I frequent to watch fools hurt themselves on skate boards / motorcycles etc I saw a clip entitled 'Airbus in 4 minutes' even though the clip is just over 3:30 long. While watching it being painted a fetching grey it dawned on me ( when I saw the kangaroo roundel) that its one of the RAAF's refuellers. It can be viewed here:

WorldWideWeb.fridaypage.com

Sorry I havn't reached the magic 15 post requirement to paste in the full url.
I'm sure you'll figure it out.
Cheers
 

Goknub

Active Member
UAVs

Magoo - was making a more general point that once UAVs try to match the capabilities of higher-end manned aircraft, the cost of removing the pilot is going to be significant. A true UCAV is likely to have costs similar to the F-22.
 

battlensign

New Member
While browsing a web site I frequent to watch fools hurt themselves on skate boards / motorcycles etc I saw a clip entitled 'Airbus in 4 minutes' even though the clip is just over 3:30 long. While watching it being painted a fetching grey it dawned on me ( when I saw the kangaroo roundel) that its one of the RAAF's refuellers. It can be viewed here:

WorldWideWeb.fridaypage.com

Sorry I havn't reached the magic 15 post requirement to paste in the full url.
I'm sure you'll figure it out.
Cheers
This reminds me a lot of the time when I watched an episode of the Discovery Channel (Cable-Australia) program Mega Factories and the show focused on the M1A1-AIM program to refurbish older M1's etc........the tanks shown undergoing the process all had kangaroos on them.... :)

Brett.
 

Sea Toby

New Member
I suggest making a few posts on the other boards here to get your count up. Thanks for the A-330 Roundel. Yes, google is great and so is You Tube.
 

sunderer

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Someone will get there arse kicked over that, those photos were not to be released and were not even supposed to be spread within the RAAF, yet here they are. The thing that did make me laugh though was the damage to the ray-dome, I hope the ray-gun is OK.
 
A

Aussie Digger

Guest
Fighter jet contract to fly

Ian Mcphedran and Malcolm Farr

Anyone REALLY surprised by this? I think the review was REALLY just a way to find a political excuse for blaming the former Government for "forcing" the Rudd Government to "reluctantly" proceed with this acquisition...

A high-level review of the nation's air combat capability, due out later this month, will give the green light to the controversial F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) project.

Defence Minister Joel Fitzgibbon commissioned the review which, according to defence insiders, will recommend that the Government delay the final decision to sign up to the US-built plane so it can push for a lower price.

Such a delay, which experts say could save taxpayers up to $750 million, has been made possible by the Howard government's decision to buy 24 Boeing Super Hornet fighters to fill any potential "capability gaps" between 2011, when the F-III fleet retires, and 2014 when the JSF was due in service.

However, a senior executive from the builder, US aerospace giant Lockheed Martin, yesterday warned that any delay could push up the price.

The firm's business development vice-president Robert Weiss said "stability in commitment" was important in delivering the multi-role fighter at the lowest price.

The JSF is being developed in conjunction with 18 other nations and Lockheed is looking to Australia to show leadership in othe region for its introduction.

"We are looking at ways to provide all the coalition partners with stability in the pricing," Mr Weiss said.

"So in order to do that, it requires stability in the commitment of the partners as well, to provide that stable pricing.

"And the other side of that, it requires the partners to stay with the current production profile (schedule)."

Lockheed wants a firm decision by the Australian Government next year and has pledged to deliver four F-35s in 2013, eight in 2014 and 15 in 2015.

The Government has the option of buying more Super Hornets to cover any further gaps created by the early retirement of the RAAF's fleet of ageing F/A-18 Hornet fighters.

That would allow it to further delay the JSF delivery date beyond 2014 and to press for an even lower price.

Unlike civilian aircraft contracts, military aircraft cost more for customers who buy early.

Courtesy of:

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,23561008-953,00.html
 

Tasman

Ship Watcher
Verified Defense Pro
"Unauthorised' or not it's an interesting, if somewhat scary, photo. Great job by the crew to get their plane down safely.

Tas
 

barra

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Someone will get there arse kicked over that, those photos were not to be released and were not even supposed to be spread within the RAAF, yet here they are. The thing that did make me laugh though was the damage to the ray-dome, I hope the ray-gun is OK.
Still it has taken over a week for the "story" to come out, the ADF is so anal with media contact. Its not the first time a pelican has tried to take out an
F-111, I am sure it is deliberate. Last time one of the aircrew was decapitated after the bird went through the windshield.

Maybe someone will get their arse kicked, these are unofficial photos, you can see the RAAF photog setting up his tripod in the first photo. This is why they have the big "no cameras" signs at the base entrance.
 

sunderer

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
The RAAF would have released them but the policy is until the investigation is complete no media comment or photos,although in this case its obvious what happened.
 

Grandstrat

New Member
Report In the Australian today

Joint strike fighter RAAF's choice

Font Size:DecreaseIncreasePrint Page:print
Patrick Walters, National security editor | April 28, 2008

THE F-35 joint strike fighter will be confirmed as the best choice to become the RAAF's frontline combat aircraft in a classified review to be presented to Defence Minister Joel Fitzgibbon later this week.

The final report of the high-level review commissioned by Mr Fitzgibbon in February is also expected to rule out the much more expensive US-made F-22 Raptor fighter as an alternative buy to the F-35 JSF.

Mr Fitzgibbon ordered the review into Australia's future air combat capability as concerns have risen about the development cost and production schedules of the JSF, as well as the capability choices facing Australia as the RAAF moves to replace its long-serving F-111 bombers and the frontline F/A-18 fighters after 2010.

The F-35 is being built by Lockheed Martin and funded by the US and eight other partner countries, including Australia, and was selected by the Howard government in 2002 as the next-generation fighter for the air force.

The RAAF plans to acquire up to 100 F-35s from 2013 at a projected cost of $16billion, making the aircraft easily Australia's largest-ever defence buy.

The air combat capability review, led by senior defence bureaucrat Neil Orme, considered the case for and against acquiring the Raptor as well as trends in Asia-Pacific air power up to 2045.

Sources familiar with the review say it emphasises that Australia faces a far more challenging strategic environment over the next 30 years as regional air forces move to buy more sophisticated combat aircraft as well as ships and submarines.

While Australia can expect to retain a technology edge over its immediate neighbours in Southeast Asia, China will acquire 500 to 600 advanced fighter bombers over the next 30 years and is likely to surpass the US as the leading air power in East Asia.

Defence has judged that the F-35's all-round capability is still the best and most affordable platform for the RAAF's longer-term needs compared with the single-role F-22. But Mr Fitzgibbon has been keen to explore with the US Government the chances of acquiring the F-22, which at present is not for sale to overseas customers. Defence experts argue that even if Australia were allowed to buy the F-22, the RAAF could not buy enough to guarantee Australia's frontline air defence. While the procurement cost of the F-35 has risen by about 36per cent in real terms since 2002 to million a plane, the rising Australian dollar means that the RAAF is still confident it can afford the 100-strong fleet it regards as essential.
Mr Orme's findings will fundamentally shape the Government's defence white paper, due to be released at the end of the year, which will provide a clear road map for the future air force.

Opposition defence spokesman Nick Minchin, who was briefed on the F-35 and F-22 by Lockheed Martin in the US last week, said the F-35 was still clearly the best aircraft to meet Australia's needs.

The first part of the Orme review, completed last month, confirmed the Howard government's plans to retire the F-111 strike force from 2010.

It also confirmed the previous government's controversial $6billion purchase of 24 Super Hornets as a bridging fighter between the retirement of the F-111 and the arrival of the F-35.
 

Tasman

Ship Watcher
Verified Defense Pro
Report In the Australian today
So the RAAF and the previous government made the right choice afterall! :rolleyes:

As AD suggested when this was first leaked last week, no one should be surprised at the outcome of the review. It will be interesting to see how Defmin Fitzgibbon 'spins' this when the outcome is officially announced.

Tas
 
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