Thai Air Force news

[weasel1962]

Deleted

 

[Tasman]

Tot I start a thread.

Jet fighter purchase under review
Bangkok Post
Feb 26, 2007
By Wassana Nanuam

Air force chief Chalit Phukphasuk is reviewing the jet fighter procurement plan, saying he is now free to decide what is best for the air force. The air force is considering several options, including F-16s from the US and JAS-39 Gripen jets from Sweden, to replace its ageing F-16 and F-5 jet fighters, he said. ACM Chalit said the air force had been under pressure to purchase Russian SU-30 fighters when the Thaksin government was in power.

''Now there is no pressure for us to go for the SU-30s,'' he said.

The air force's choice was likely to be dictated by its budget and its needs. The purchase would be undertaken in the next fiscal year.

''Each of the jet models is fine, but we have to pick one that best fits our requirements,'' ACM Chalit said.

It was reported that he was opposed to the large Russian aircraft from the start because they were too big, too fast and fuel hungry.

But he bowed to pressure to include them in the list for consideration following a report that Thaksin Shinawatra, then prime minister, would replace him if he failed to strike the deal with Moscow.

Russia tried to sweeten the sale by offering the air force eight MI-17 helicopters for free and annual training for 30 Thai officers.

The air force eventually set up a special panel to consider the Russian option.

The deal was to have been made on a barter basis with Bangkok giving farm produce, mainly chicken, to Russia in return for the fighters.

With all the talk about how good the Su-30s are I find it very interesting that the Air Force Chief, when freed from government pressure, has moved to acquire other types instead. I wonder how many Russian sales are the result of sweetheart deals (like the MI-17 offer) and bargaining in other areas such as trade rather than the quality of the aircraft on offer?

How many aircraft are involved?

Cheers

 

[weasel1962]

Re:

Deleted

 

[old faithful]

Interesting how the US and Aust etc didnt express their outrage over the recent coup in Thailand...it was almost like "dog surfs,hot and sunny tomorrow,and in other news,there has been a little bit of a coup in Thailand,now back to the surfing dog"!nfloorl:
I agree,I really beleive that the result of a lot of Russian arms deals centre around bartering,palm oil,chickens etc rather than cash, which would suggest that if those countries had the cash then they would choose a western product. Even when Pakistan buys a Chinese airframe,they usually upgrade with western software and systems.
It makes very little sense for Thailand to go Russian when its Airforce is mainly equiped with US airframes.To the best of my knowledge,Thailand has had very close ties with the US sinse the Vietnam war.

 

[davedogman]

With all the talk about how good the Su-30s are I find it very interesting that the Air Force Chief, when freed from government pressure, has moved to acquire other types instead. I wonder how many Russian sales are the result of sweetheart deals (like the MI-17 offer) and bargaining in other areas such as trade rather than the quality of the aircraft on offer?

How many aircraft are involved?

Cheers

16 x JAS39 Gripen's or 16 x F-16 or 12 x SU-30's has been on the table before.

Before the Russian sweetener's, barter deal nonsense and strange things in Gov the Gripen had been selected in 2004.

 

[contedicavour]

I wonder if there are plans to update the ageing Navy fighters : the A7s and the AV8A (formerly Spanish). I've read repeatedly that they are not operational.
The small carrier isn't operational either...
I'd go for a dozen used F18A/Bs in USN inventory and use the small carrier as a helo ship for amphibious troops or for the emergency relief operations after the relatively frequent natural disasters that plague the region.

cheers

 

[Startingengines]

Interesting how the US and Aust etc didnt express their outrage over the recent coup in Thailand...it was almost like "dog surfs,hot and sunny tomorrow,and in other news,there has been a little bit of a coup in Thailand,now back to the surfing dog"!nfloorl:
I agree,I really beleive that the result of a lot of Russian arms deals centre around bartering,palm oil,chickens etc rather than cash, which would suggest that if those countries had the cash then they would choose a western product. Even when Pakistan buys a Chinese airframe,they usually upgrade with western software and systems.
It makes very little sense for Thailand to go Russian when its Airforce is mainly equiped with US airframes.To the best of my knowledge,Thailand has had very close ties with the US sinse the Vietnam war.

Yep, but after the recent coup, this relationship suffered as a result... thought the bilateral ex between the US and RTA & RTAF continued, i doubt the US Defence council will approve any sale of military stuffs to Thailand, till they resume democracy...

I hope they get US planes, SU-30MKM do look impressive when it flies, but to make sure this monster takeoff, the maintenance must be robust and reliable, unfortunately the Russina planes are not built to last (or rather the engines). So to stop gap till the JSF comes online, why risk?

MHO

 

[renjer]

Given what the ACM said, I would go for the latest F-16s over the Gripen. There's commonality there with the previous versions. Should take care of a lot of the backroom problems.

 

[Tasman]

I wonder if there are plans to update the ageing Navy fighters : the A7s and the AV8A (formerly Spanish). I've read repeatedly that they are not operational.
The small carrier isn't operational either...
I'd go for a dozen used F18A/Bs in USN inventory and use the small carrier as a helo ship for amphibious troops or for the emergency relief operations after the relatively frequent natural disasters that plague the region.

cheers

I never could see the Thailand's need for a carrier, other than perhaps for prestige purposes. Its small size though was interesting in that it tested the limits for VSTOL operations. The idea of using it as a helicopter carrier to support amphibious operations makes sense. It could be kept operational with a smaller crew and perhaps double as a training ship in peacetime.

Yep, but after the recent coup, this relationship suffered as a result... thought the bilateral ex between the US and RTA & RTAF continued, i doubt the US Defence council will approve any sale of military stuffs to Thailand, till they resume democracy...

I hope they get US planes, SU-30MKM do look impressive when it flies, but to make sure this monster takeoff, the maintenance must be robust and reliable, unfortunately the Russina planes are not built to last (or rather the engines). So to stop gap till the JSF comes online, why risk?

MHO

If Thailand can't get US aircraft I would go for the Gripen rather than the Su-30s, for the reasons you give.

Cheers

 

[weasel1962]

Re:

Deleted

 

[Tasman]

Would leasing F16 be a cheaper option (and purchasing F35s at a later date)?

If Thailand seriously wants to get into the JSF program and if the US will supply the aircraft then a lease of a bridging aircraft may have merits. An advanced version of the F-16 would be a good choice because it would be relatively easy to absorb a version of an aircraft already in service (a bit like the FA-18F in Australia's case). I guess it would depend on whether a lease would offer substantial savings. Maybe Lockheed Martin would offer a good deal if it will lead to another F-35 customer.

Cheers

 

[Aussie Digger]

I never could see the Thailand's need for a carrier, other than perhaps for prestige purposes. Its small size though was interesting in that it tested the limits for VSTOL operations. The idea of using it as a helicopter carrier to support amphibious operations makes sense. It could be kept operational with a smaller crew and perhaps double as a training ship in peacetime.

If Thailand can't get US aircraft I would go for the Gripen rather than the Su-30s, for the reasons you give.

Cheers

To buy Gripen you need US export approval anyway. They are powered by the RM-12, an export derivative of the F-404 that will be powering our Super Hornets, should they be chosen...

 

[Tasman]

To buy Gripen you need US export approval anyway. They are powered by the RM-12, an export derivative of the F-404 that will be powering our Super Hornets, should they be chosen...

That severely limits the options then and creates a bit of a headache for both Thailand and the US if Startingengines is right about problems getting approval from the US Defence Council. I doubt the US would want Thailand to buy Russian and the other two on the short list need US approval! It sounds like Thailand either needs to be able to satisfy the US regarding its progress back to democracy or look for other alternatives if it doesn't want the Su-30.

Cheers

 

[Aussie Digger]

Yep, but after the recent coup, this relationship suffered as a result... thought the bilateral ex between the US and RTA & RTAF continued, i doubt the US Defence council will approve any sale of military stuffs to Thailand, till they resume democracy...

I hope they get US planes, SU-30MKM do look impressive when it flies, but to make sure this monster takeoff, the maintenance must be robust and reliable, unfortunately the Russina planes are not built to last (or rather the engines). So to stop gap till the JSF comes online, why risk?

MHO

Who knows? I have read The USA and Australia are actually very pleased about the removal of that particular Government, hence the lack of "outcry" over the coup, so perhaps all is not lost???

 

[contedicavour]

Who knows? I have read The USA and Australia are actually very pleased about the removal of that particular Government, hence the lack of "outcry" over the coup, so perhaps all is not lost???

Well the US have rarely refrained from supplying allied countries despite not-exactly-democratic regimes ... and no need to go back to the '70s or the '80s to find the regimes I'm talking about (most of our Middle Eastern allies for example)

cheers

 

[old faithful]

Who knows? I have read The USA and Australia are actually very pleased about the removal of that particular Government, hence the lack of "outcry" over the coup, so perhaps all is not lost???

i agree,i think that the US,and other major trding partners with Thailand are very pleased that the the coup has taken place,hence the little almost no media coverage or outcry since the coup. I know for my company,it meant one day off work..then back to buisness as usual.