F16 and Mirage 2000

[gf0012-aust]

Has the PAF flown any F16's against IAF Mirage 2000's?

If so what was the outcome?

Has the PAF done flyoff comparisons against the Mirage 2000 or only against the ROSE?

 

[The Watcher]

As far as I know, PAF hasn't flown any f-16 against IAF's mirages. Its possible that simulations have been done on both sides in this matter.

 

[gf0012-aust]

As far as I know, PAF hasn't flown any f-16 against IAF's mirages. Its possible that simulations have been done on both sides in this matter.

One of my French colleagues has said that it has happened, he's not happy as I told him that I think he is wrong...

(He doesn't like being wrong)

 

[The Watcher]

When did that happen? What was the outcome?

French don't like being wrong very much like our indian friends. :lol (relax i was just joking!!!)

 

[gf0012-aust]

When did that happen? What was the outcome?

French don't like being wrong very much like our indian friends. :lol (relax i was just joking!!!)

I think he may be confused - he can't actually tell me. I think he is confusing Kargil with Kashmir...

 

[elkaboingo]

im sure we have flown our mirage III/V against f-16 in training for dogfights. the f-16 won.

 

[Red aRRow]

Has the PAF flown any F16's against IAF Mirage 2000's?

If so what was the outcome?

Has the PAF done flyoff comparisons against the Mirage 2000 or only against the ROSE?

Gimme some days. I'll contact my source in PAF.

 

[Londo Molari]

PAF pilots have test flown Mirage-2000-5 from France when Pakistan was interested in a purchase.

They said the Mirage 2000-5 was more advanced than the old Pakistani Block 15 F-16 A/Bs, and a great strike aircraft. But in the area of air-to-air combat, specially dogfighting, the Mirage 2000-5 was not so great. Someone even said that an F-7 was more manouverable.

Pakistani pilots have also flown UAE Mirage-2000-9... so they are well aware of the capabilities of the aircraft.

Indian pilots have flown American Block 40 F-16Cs at certain training bases before their exercises last year.

So both pilots know a lot about the enemy's aircraft.

 

[Red aRRow]

Ok as far as the news goes, there haven't been any exercise or confrontation between PAF F-16s and Indian mirages.
I've said it before and I'll say it again...only confrontation between a Mirage 2000 and an F-16 was between the TuAF (THK) and the Greek AF. The Viper lost. :eek

 

[umair]

Ok as far as the news goes, there haven't been any exercise or confrontation between PAF F-16s and Indian mirages.
I've said it before and I'll say it again...only confrontation between a Mirage 2000 and an F-16 was between the TuAF (THK) and the Greek AF. The Viper lost. :eek

Aaaaaaaan! :cop Wrong buddy! Apparently a PAF FALCON downed an indian Mirage2k in 1999(Kargil) using guess what an AIM-7M Sparrow :smokingc: .
Ok! I first heard about this on another forum, didn't believe it so decided to do some digging of my own.Apparently one was shot down during that conflict but it's wreckage fell on their side of the LOC.According to my info the Mirage was intruding 6 km inside our airspace.The kill was not publicised because the wreckage fell on their side.
This plus two other encounters were confirmed by my sources in which F-7s damaged Mig-23/27 BM/BNs which were able to limp back to their bases.
This won't be found on any site or acknowledged publicaly by the PAF.I first got to know about it from somebody who's father was at a top post in PAF at that time.My own inquiries with my uncle and his collleagues substantiated his version of events.
Another proof of "where there is smoke there is fire" :smokingc:

 

[umair]

So we have AIM-7Ms(with Uncle's tacit approval I wager )
I'll invite that guy over so that he can substantiate my version now.

 

[Londo Molari]

PAF does not have sparrows.

PAF has not downed a Mirage 2000.

Sounds too good to be true.... people start rumours left and right, and it spreads like wild-fire on the internet.

 

[webmaster]

Somebody in PAF also told me that mirage was downed with a sparrow. Unless we get some type of confirmation from both countries, its very hard to determine.

 

[ullu]

PAF does not have sparrows.

PAF has not downed a Mirage 2000.

Sounds too good to be true.... people start rumours left and right, and it spreads like wild-fire on the internet.

How can you say PAF does not have sparrows?

 

[Londo Molari]

They simply do not.

PAF has official inventory listings, and the Sparrow is not in it.

Also, there would be pictures of the F-16 with a sparrow if we DID have it.

Its just like the other rumour that we have the Super 530-D missile for the mirage.

 

[Red aRRow]

Well I haven't still gotten hold of my source yet. I don´t think PAF has any Sparows. It´s an semi-active radar guided missile in which the firing aircraft constantly needs to paint the target with its radar and upload the information to the missile through its rear antenna. I don´t think PAF F-16 radars have such a range to fully exploit the Sparrow. Would be useless to have them without the good airplane radars.

 

[Aussie Digger]

Well Pakistan has reasonably late model Sidewinders (AIM -9L or M I believe) and Paveway 11 LGB's, so why not Sparrows? Londo you don't seriously think that Pakistan publicises it's actual weapons holdings do you? Very few (if any) do. That would be a grave threat to one's national security, if they released that sort of information... Most Countries don't even allow weapon serial numbers to be published or photographed and released publicly in case they should fall into the hands of a foreign Intell analyst...

 

[Red aRRow]

Well could be.
But this thing about an IAF mirage being downed..I think I've heard it before too. Now whether it was done by a Sparrow or something else ...we don't know.

 

[Londo Molari]

I don´t think PAF F-16 radars have such a range to fully exploit the Sparrow. Would be useless to have them without the good airplane radars.

We don't have sparrows, but the PAF DID get our F-16s upgraded with the APG-66 radar will can fully exploit the AIM-7 Sparrow and the AIM-120 AMRAAM. That was back when we were silly enough to the think that the U.S. would sell us useful missiles. Its sad really... we had the F-16 primed for medium range combat, but no missiles.

Thats why you might hear "Our F-16s are BVR capable". We have the capability, but no missiles. (The Mirage V ROSE also has a radar with similar capabilities, hence the rumour about the Super 530D).

But atleast it means that PAF trains in BVR scenarios, and when we DO get the SD-10, the transition and using of tactics will be smooth.

 

[umair]

I don´t think PAF F-16 radars have such a range to fully exploit the Sparrow. Would be useless to have them without the good airplane radars.

We don't have sparrows, but the PAF DID get our F-16s upgraded with the APG-66 radar will can fully exploit the AIM-7 Sparrow and the AIM-120 AMRAAM. That was back when we were silly enough to the think that the U.S. would sell us useful missiles. Its sad really... we had the F-16 primed for medium range combat, but no missiles.

Thats why you might hear "Our F-16s are BVR capable". We have the capability, but no missiles. (The Mirage V ROSE also has a radar with similar capabilities, hence the rumour about the Super 530D).

But atleast it means that PAF trains in BVR scenarios, and when we DO get the SD-10, the transition and using of tactics will be smooth.

Hey Buddy! I also thought that all this Sparrow talk was BS(read my previous posts) but after getting the rumor confirmed from a number of sources in the PAF ,I began to believe and still do that we do have AIM-7Ms(I was told the exact model,(M) type by a friend of my uncle's who's served in one of our Falcon squads #9 I guess)The Super R.530D is however bogus, although it was offered with the ROSEs but we declined.