Iraqi Armed Force Discussions : Iraqi MIG Return Home !

[Almaleki]

Iraqi Armed Force Discussions : Iraq Pressures on US for F-16

Hey ,,

This Topic is all about Talking in IAF and writting the latest News , Blogs writings and FAQs ... and this will start from today and i have somethings to write them for you .. anyone is welcome to write ..

Cheers ,, will start in my first reply

 

[Almaleki]

Headlines : 1/September/2009

Iraq Gets his Jets Back from Serbia :

BAGHDAD — Iraqi officials have discovered that they may have a real air force, after all.

The Defense Ministry revealed Sunday that it had recently learned that Iraq owns 19 MiG-21 and MiG-23 jet fighters, which are in storage in Serbia. Ministry officials are negotiating with the Serbs to restore and return the aircraft.

The Serbian government has tentatively promised to make two of the aircraft available "for immediate use," according to a news release from the ministry. The rest would be restored on a rush basis, the ministry said.

An Iraqi delegation went to Serbia as part of an effort by the government to locate assets stashed abroad by Saddam Hussein to evade sanctions. Serbia had had friendly relations with Saddam's government.

During that visit, Serbian defense officials told the Iraqis that Saddam had sent 19 fighter jets to Serbia for repairs in the late 1980s, during the Iran-Iraq war, but was unable to bring them back after sanctions were imposed on his country.

Iraq immediately sent a technical delegation, led by the air force chief, Gen. Anwar Mohammed Amin.

The website of the Iraqi Supreme Islamic Council, the leading Shiite political party, quoted Defense Ministry spokesman Mohammed al-Askari as saying that the aircraft had been sent in 1989 "for maintenance, and everything was paid for by Iraq's money."

Askari said the discovery was important because Iraq had no jet aircraft with defensive or offensive capabilities. "Our air force only has helicopters," he said.

The Defense Ministry statement was issued as a rebuttal to Iraqi news reports claiming that secret negotiations were under way with Serbia as part of a corrupt arms deal.

source

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French Frim wins Arm Deal with Iraq : Building an Airport and Naval Craft :

Two French companies said on Friday they had won business contracts worth up to 90 million euros from the Iraqi authorities to build naval craft and an airport in the country.
Iraqi authorities promised shipbuilder OCEA a contract worth up to 60 million euros (84 million dollars) to build two naval support vessels, its chief executive Roland Joassard said.

It also applied for a deal to build six naval interceptor craft.

ADPI, part of the Paris airport operator ADP, beat off competition from three US firms to win a 30-million-euro contract to design an airport in Karbala, south of the capital, its director Alain Le Pajolec said.

He added that his company was in the running for an airport project in Baghdad and in the major southern city of Basra.

French Prime Minister Francois Fillon visited Baghdad on Thursday with a delegation of officials and business leaders, two days after US troops withdrew from urban areas under a pact that will see them leave Iraq by the end of 2011.

source

Cheers

 

[Almaleki]

Topics About the Iraqi Army Published By Me ... in Defence Talk Forums :

Iraqi Armor Status :
http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/army-security-forces/iraqi-heavy-armor-status-changing-9481/

Info About Iraqi M1A1SA Tanks Deal :
http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/army-security-forces/140-m1a1-sa-tanks-iraq-last-8887/

Iraq thinks about Leclercs :
http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/army-security-forces/iraq-thinks-about-leclerc-mbt-9467/

Offshore Military Support Vessels for the Iraqi Navy :
http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/navy-maritime/offshore-support-vessels-government-iraq-9476/

Speculations About that Iraqi Ground Forces Current Status and Future :
http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/army-security-forces/iraqi-army-now-future-9475/

Cheers ,,,

 

[Ryan UK]

In my opinion Iraq should just forget about those Migs in Serbia, they are obselete and probably not airworthy. It would likely cost the Iraqi Govt more overtime to refurbish them to operational standards than buying a batch of second hand F-16s from the US.

While were on the subject what happened to all the Iraqi Airforce Aircraft which escaped to Jordan in 2003? I know iran claimed the Aircraft from the 1st Gulf War as "reperations."

 

[Almaleki]

No jets went to Jordan .. just To Iran ... and the Mig-23 are Airworthy they are MLD Flogger-K And they arte in good Condition

 

[Ryan UK]

No jets went to Jordan .. just To Iran ... and the Mig-23 are Airworthy they are MLD Flogger-K And they arte in good Condition

Edit:

Just did some research and the coalition expected them to flee to Jordan but they never did.

 

[Almaleki]

Hey // Serbia say these Jets are not Airwothy and in their Refbrubishment money you could buy new ones :

BELGRADE (AFP) – Serbia confirmed on Wednesday that Iraq was interested in recovering warplanes that Saddam Hussein's regime sent to the then Yugoslavia for servicing 20 years ago, but said they were not airworthy.

"A certain number of MiG-21 and MiG-23 aircraft were brought to Zagreb in the late 1980s for maintenance," the defence ministry's press office said in a statement sent to AFP.

During the war in Croatia which accompanied the break-up of Yugoslavia, most were taken to Serbia "in a useless condition, while one plane in relatively bad condition flew from Zagreb to Belgrade," the statement said.

It added that Serbian Defence Minister Dragan Sutanovac had told Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki about the planes during a recent visit to Baghdad.

"Iraqi authorities have expressed interest in making those aircraft operational, which will be analysed by the defence ministries of Serbia and Iraq," the statement said.

The ministry neither confirmed nor denied that an Iraqi delegation has already been in Belgrade negotiating the return of the planes, as announced last week in Baghdad by Iraqi defence ministry spokesman General Mohammed al-Askari.

The Soviet-built MiGs "were sent by Saddam's government in 1989 for maintenance and everything was paid for with Iraqi money," Askari said on Saturday.

He said the planes are important for Iraq as "our air force only possesses helicopters."

The Iraqi official said Baghdad was seeking to recover 19 of the aircraft.

The former Serbian-dominated Yugoslavia had close links with Saddam's regime, which was toppled in 2003 by a US-led invasion, and was a major exporter of arms to Baghdad before breaking up in the 1990s.

Last week Sutanovac announced a deal under which Serbia would export 100 million dollars worth of weapons to Iraq.

source : Iraqi warplanes sent to Serbia by Saddam unfit to fly: Belgrade - Yahoo! News

 

[Almaleki]

Ok ,,, Iraq is putting Pressure on The US FMS ,, Iraq have been negotiating 18 F-16 Jet from USA for 2 Years ... and the US was Delaying That option ... As Al-Oabiadi Said the IMOD Minister We need At Least some Air-Support by 2011 we Have to get it and i am ready to Obtain it from anywhere but it must be Capable anyway US Military Officials from Sunday the Day that Iraq Announced that it is going for Some MIG Fighters ( which is not Air Worthy but it is used like a Card on the US ) The US Officials said that they will give Iraq Immediately 5 F-16 Squadrons of the 134 Jet retired this Year and they will make it fully Operational ... the Jets will be in a very less Cost or no Initial Cost At all for Iraq but Refurbishment Order will be done by the Iraqi Paid Money and that will be At most for some only Painting them and putting some New Thrust Engines in them ... Iraq before one month in Gates Visit had Enough but they did not have their Card ,, US is the only Supplier for a Multi-Role Fighter .. but as China looked forward for Cut in pricing to sell some of Multi-role Fighters and the Mig-23s in Belgrade it looks like Iraq have that Card of pressure they need and the Iraqi New Air force Leader An Ex-Commander in the Old Iraqi Army Verified that iraq will have at least some Jets Patrolling its Skies by 2012 ... and Iraq also Have the French Option which Sarkozy gave Iraq Un-limited choice between what France Manufacture but still the Iraqis is just looking for US-Fighters ,,, maybe Because of Logistics Matters any way From Reuters Jim Wolf talked to American Official About that :

-----------------------
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. Air Force is crafting several options designed to meet an Iraqi request for Lockheed Martin Corp F-16 fighter aircraft, a senior Air Force official said on Wednesday.

Whether new or refurbished, the F-16 is a potential key to fostering U.S. and Iraqi ability to operate together in the future, said Bruce Lemkin, the Air Force's point person for international affairs.

"It is extraordinarily important," he told Reuters by telephone. "It's not just the airplane. It's the partnership that comes with it."

France, Russia, China and others have been jockeying to help fill Iraq's multibillion-dollar arms wish list, which features multi-role fighters to defend its air space after U.S. forces are due to leave by the end of 2011.

"Flying the same airplane that we do becomes not only the centerpiece of the relationship," but aligns maintenance, logistics and operational concepts among other things, Lemkin said.

He said the sale of new F-16s was one of the possibilities being weighed in an "air sovereignty assessment" being carried out in Baghdad by the U.S. Air Force with Iraqi counterparts.

Another possibility is declaring certain retired U.S. Air Force F-16s as "excess" inventory, a step toward providing them to Iraq at little or no initial cost, he said.

Iraq, however, would have to pay for refurbishing the aircraft, pilot training, spare parts, building facilities and possibly putting in new engines, Lemkin said.

The U.S. Air Force assessment of Iraq's needs is being carried out by Lieutenant General Mike Hostage, head of the U.S. Central Command's Air Force component. Lemkin said he expected it to be sent to Defense Secretary Robert Gates "much sooner" than the end of this year.

Authorities in Baghdad have said they must have a multi-role aircraft to defend Iraqi sovereignty before U.S. forces complete their phased withdrawal.

Defense Minister Abdel Qader Jassim said in July that Iraq had "many alternatives" for securing fighter aircraft if the United States failed to supply F-16s.

"We have to have the right airplane to protect our skies in 2011," he said at a July 28 joint news conference with Gates while the U.S. defense secretary was visiting Baghdad. "Wherever we can get it, we are going to obtain it."

In March, Lieutenant General Anwar Ahmed, the head of the Iraqi Air Force, told Reuters that Iraq hoped to sign an initial contract for 18 advanced F-16 models as part of billions of dollars Iraq is expected to spend on arms in the coming years.

His goal, he said, was to acquire up to 96 F-16s through 2020, citing perceived threats from Iran and Syria after U.S. forces leave.

Lemkin, in the interview with Reuters, declined to say whether he was confident that the United States could supply F-16s before 2012.

"I think we ought to wait until we complete this air sovereignty assessment," he said. "And then, what are the capabilities (Iraq needs). And what are the optimal means of meeting that."

Among issues that must be factored in is the F-16s' offensive capability, said Kenneth Katzman, a Middle East expert at the Congressional Research Service.

Iraq's ethnic Kurds "fear that this type of weapon might be used against them," he said.

(Reporting by Jim Wolf; editing by Tim Dobbyn)

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Kurds Had/Have been a big Obstacle in many of The US-Iraqi Arms Deals ...

Today the Pushmerga Minister in Kurdistan Government ( like Defense Minister ) already said that He is Against the New Iraqi Army Arms Deals and they are scared of us being savage with them ... well if the lift their Hands of Kirkuk Oil we wont be too-savage ...

Cheers

 

[Ryan UK]

Interesting Iraq has the right idea though they want to be able to rely on themselves rather than the US and will do it by any means necessary... I like that shows that the country has a future.

Perhpas the iraqi government should look into buying some mirage 2000s from the French then. They will cover the needs for the IAF and be reasonably cheap, they could probably secure a weapons for oil deal with the French aswell whereas with the Russians it would probably be cash.

What exactly are the chinese offering the Iraqis? And the Russians I presume would like to export some Su-30 a decent choice but there not the most reliable nation around when it comes to delivery dates.

IMO it will likely be an F-16 or Mirages which win the contract

 

[Almaleki]

Well i think they will fo with F-16s and A-50s as they have the same spare Parts/Logistics .. iraq needs 14 Squadron that will be 252 Jet ... 5 of them were declared as F-16s iraq may get French . Russian ot Chinese Mult-role Fighters for the other Squadrons that will have also some Training Jets that is maybe some T-50s from Korea ...

 

[Almaleki]

The Latest news are :

Iraq is very surious about having those 13 Squadron of F-15s/F-16s ... even that they might just take the F-16s until new builds come ...

Serbs offered Iraq 40 Fishbed Mig-21 but the Iraqis dont look very Impressed By that .. the Serbs from 2006 were giving us Weapons but ... they never told Us about the Mig-23s ...

 

[Almaleki]

New Topic on ISF :

http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/air-force-aviation/us-lend-lease-f-16s-weapons-iraq-9519/

 

[Welburn75]

For a stop gap, which these inevitably are while Iraq waits for f-16's and 15's to create an air force, Undoubtedly america and other allies involved(or were involved) in the operation in Iraq are keen to rebuild Iraq's strength and get out, leaving a potent nation that will be on their side in such a volatile region.
These aircraft will allow Iraq to re-learn how to use aircraft in the role which the are now used and get all member of the Iraqi military a knowledge of working with Iraqi air power.
Therefore Iraq getting these aircraft is a good step forward for all involved

 

[benaakatz]

who are the iraqis looking to defend themselves from?

obviously they have to take into account the iranians.

after that, do they have any other perceivable threats?

 

[stoker]

who are the iraqis looking to defend themselves from?

obviously they have to take into account the iranians.

after that, do they have any other perceivable threats?

Basically all their threats will be internal ethnic and religous based..

i.e Kurdish seperatists, Sunni extremists and power hungry fundamentalist ayatollahs.